Civilian vs military 833c

[Alaphablue]

How do I tell if my s&g 833 is military or civilian . What do you look for and what are the differences .

[spandexwarrior]

Usually by the keyway and the cylinder. The military locks will be on the D4 keyway and have a green teflon coating on the cylinder. Non-military locks for the Gov't will be on the R1 keyway and don't have the teflon coating. Non-gov't locks will use the S1 keyway and probably won't have the teflon coating.

There is a video that Han Fey did comparing two versions of the locks and they had different S&G stamps. The military lock also had identification/serial numbers stamped into the major components and the 'civilian' model didn't. I haven't seen any other locks with the numbers and I have locks that were from military contracts that didn't have the numbers so my experience doesn't indicate that this is reliable in all cases.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid ... 0516789113

-Brian

[Alaphablue]

Han feys video was what made me wonder if mine was military cause it dosent have numbers stamped on the front like
His. My 833 has green Teflon and the right key way Thats great news . Some one told me the small logo on the front means it's military . I wonder why they don't all have ID numbers like Hans . Unfortunately it only came with operating key so I modified it . Also I here people say 833 and 833c are they the same ?

[Squelchtone]

Hi,
The civilian S1 keyway comes in Teflon. The brass R1 everyone bought on ebay was an early edition and most D4, R1, and S1 are Teflon. The small or large casting mark just tells you if it was made in 1990 or 1991. All D4 keyway locks are military and the most common on ebay. I bought an S1 cylinder from my locksmith for $95 and almost had to sign my life away to get it. I have a brass prototype 833 cylinder from 1987 which is some exotic biaxial keyway and does not match D4 or R1 or anything else out there, I do have keys for it. the han fey video is interesting because it is the only military 833 I have ever seen with matching numbers stamped. Either Han got a very early one that happened to be stamped or it was a one of a kind. The reason they dont all have numbers is because it takes too much time and effort which equals money.

You'll be interested in knowing that the new model 951 padlock explicitly says US Govt Property on a square stamp on the top half if it is military, and if civilian the square area on the top of the padlock is blank. Each padlock is also stamped with matching numbers.

The 1987 prototype lock I have is an 832, I think I saw an 833A prototype, I don't recall a b model, and C was the official designation of the one that the military adopted. I believe 833 and 833c is the same thing, the c was not 'civilian', but the new model 951 does it this way, the 951 is military and the 951c is the civilian keyway.

The 833-009 was the civilian keyway version, funny enough there used to only be 833-001 (DoD version D4 keyway) and 833-005 (civilian version, S1 keyway) as seen in Han's video.

[Alaphablue]

Very interesting I only collect Sargent and green leaf padlocks so every bit of knowledge is good . Squelchtone there is so much mis information on the Internet its like you have to filter out the junk . When you finish that paper I would be pay to get a autographed copy to keep with my collection.

[drydog]

otherwise know as commercial .

[ARF-GEF]

Spandexwarrior could you repost the link to Han Fey's video? The link is not working (Long links get shortened, and unusable unless you use the "url" button when posting.)
Thanks

[Alaphablue]

smells like necro in here

[jharveee]

[ARF-GEF]

Ohh I didn't realise the thread was necroed