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my new sargent and greenleaf 8400 needed some parts

PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2014 3:27 pm
by femurat
Image

Image

I got this lock body, looks like a Sargent and Greenleaf 8400 and is missing the dial and the ball bearing.
If you have them or can buy them for me please let me know.

Cheers :)

Re: my new sargent and greenleaf 8400 needs some parts

PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2014 5:04 pm
by huxleypig
Wow, it says manipulation proof! Is that true?

Re: my new sargent and greenleaf 8400 needs some parts

PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2014 5:45 pm
by GWiens2001
They say it is, though I have heard otherwise. My S&G 8500 does not drop the lever onto the wheel pack until the dial is set to 0, and it locks the dial in place so you can not feel gates.

Gordon

Re: my new sargent and greenleaf 8400 needs some parts

PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2014 10:00 pm
by Neilau
Looks like they have incorporated some of the features of their 8088 combination padlock and they ARE manipulation proof as far as I can ascertain. I'd love to know if anyone has ever manipulated one open or heard of anyone who has.

Dial back to 0 to open.

That would be that U shaped gate, if I'm guessing right.

Nice scores. Particularly the Manifoil - great name.

Re: my new sargent and greenleaf 8400 needs some parts

PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2014 10:06 pm
by scudo
It looks like it is possible, check the link........

http://www.lsieducation.com/courses/group_1.html

Re: my new sargent and greenleaf 8400 needs some parts

PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2014 11:56 pm
by Neilau
Thanks scudl for the link.

The 8400s obviously can be manipulated albeit with a great deal of difficulty (and cost to learn the techniques) but I still have not heard of anyone manipulating an 8088 combination padlock.

I've studied the patents (US 2673457 and US 2625032) and can't see how one could.

BUT

I am nowhere near an expert on manipulation and would love to hear if anyone has or knows of one being manipulated (the 8088). There may be other ways of non destructive opening but manipulation ???????

I don't want to hijack this thread onto another subject, so if anyone knows of an 8088 being manipulated opened - maybe a new thread or PM.

Thanks.

Re: my new sargent and greenleaf 8400 needs some parts

PostPosted: Sat Feb 08, 2014 12:14 am
by scudo

Re: my new sargent and greenleaf 8400 needs some parts

PostPosted: Sat Feb 08, 2014 12:44 am
by Neilau
Thanks again.

He did not manipulate the lock, just describe it.

In order to see into or insert a shim/wire into the change key hole you either have to know the combination or drill a hole (destructive) entry.

I have heard about the so called vulnerability using a very fine wire but have never seen/heard a description of it.

BTW, I have one and it doesn't matter what way you spin the dial to set it up for the combination to be dialed. You can spin the dial 4 times left or right. Also you can dial in the combination left or right.

Check out the patents. The fence is nowhere near the wheel pack until you dial 0 and pull the shackle. It's a brilliant design.

:D

Cheers.

Re: my new sargent and greenleaf 8400 needs some parts

PostPosted: Sat Feb 08, 2014 1:59 am
by CPT1911
Wow great lock!

Looks like that one has both bolt position and duress switches. Are there two gates on the third wheel for the panic combi?

Re: my new sargent and greenleaf 8400 needs some parts

PostPosted: Sat Feb 08, 2014 4:14 am
by Neilau
Fermuat.

Those black units on opposite corners look like micro switches.

Never seen them before.

Any idea what they are for ??

Re: my new sargent and greenleaf 8400 needs some parts

PostPosted: Sat Feb 08, 2014 5:50 pm
by DIY Dave
I don't mean to highjack the thread, but aren't most safe dials universal? Sorry if it's a stupid question

Re: my new sargent and greenleaf 8400 needs some parts

PostPosted: Sun Feb 09, 2014 9:23 am
by Riyame
DIY Dave wrote:I don't mean to highjack the thread, but aren't most safe dials universal? Sorry if it's a stupid question



Most of the Group 2 or 6600/6700 clones will use the same style of spindle but other safe locks such as the 8400 have a little knob in the middle, some are bigger etc.

This doesn't list differences between them but does show that different locks require different dials/spindles. http://www.sargentandgreenleaf.com/MC-dialsNrings.php

Re: my new sargent and greenleaf 8400 needs some parts

PostPosted: Sun Feb 09, 2014 11:55 am
by Neilau
HI again.

Can anyone enlighten me on the function of the micro switches.

Thanks.

Re: my new sargent and greenleaf 8400 needs some parts

PostPosted: Sun Feb 09, 2014 12:22 pm
by scudo
Just a thought but could they be linked to some sort of alarm that shows when the safe is in the open position.

Re: my new sargent and greenleaf 8400 needs some parts

PostPosted: Sun Feb 09, 2014 12:33 pm
by Riyame
Neilau wrote:HI again.

Can anyone enlighten me on the function of the micro switches.

Thanks.



One looks like an open/closed sensor that is contacted when the lock is locked. This could be to log when the lock is opened or closed or to have a buzzer or something.

The other might be a duress or panic switch. When you dial a different (preset) combo than the normal one it sends an alert to security or police etc. Basically a silent alarm on the safe that somebody who knows the combo can activate.