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Friction-Fence Locks

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MartinHewitt

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Post Thu Aug 08, 2019 10:25 pm

Re: Friction-Fence Locks

I assume it is a standard and only right handed lock as in the patent for this lock there is the exactly same construction. The patent is US1484692. https://patents.google.com/patent/US148 ... =US1484692
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Riyame

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Post Fri Aug 09, 2019 10:24 am

Re: Friction-Fence Locks

MartinHewitt wrote:I assume it is a standard and only right handed lock as in the patent for this lock there is the exactly same construction. The patent is US1484692. https://patents.google.com/patent/US148 ... =US1484692


In the late 1920s S&G change their models numbers. The C87 became the 6720/5. It was available in RH or LH according to this 1927 catalog.
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Squelchtone wrote:
mine are both black ceramic coating,

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That finish is actually called "Japanning" or Japanned iron. It was used on a lot of items back in the day as a beautiful durable finish. There were a few varieties and the slow cure one could take months to fully harden.

Link here going into it. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanning

And a cool Youtube video of a guy making some modern stuff that cures in the oven.
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MartinHewitt

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Post Fri Aug 09, 2019 7:17 pm

Re: Friction-Fence Locks

The 6720 (and 6730) could be the successors to the C87. It is a different mechanism than the C87. The 6730 image shows a spring. I guess the 6720 has it too, because I don't see a different way to bring the fence into the cam gate.

Japanning is basically oil paint.
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MartinHewitt

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Post Fri Aug 09, 2019 10:53 pm

Re: Friction-Fence Locks

Of the three locks feeling the RCP of the C87 is the most easy. It is a clear stop after passing the free space of the drive cam gate.

The second most difficult is the LCP of the OC-5. I feel the free space and can stop at the CP when careful,

The most difficult is the LCP of the Mosler. I feel a slight indication of the free space and I can stop due to the slightly increased turning resistance at the CP with some precision even so I do not really feel it. Sometimes when I dial over the CP I can feel a slight bump. I am sure Oldfast would have no problem manipulating this lock with his magic fingers.
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MartinHewitt

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Post Sat Aug 10, 2019 11:42 pm

Re: Friction-Fence Locks

Added a bit lube to the Mosler. I don't feel anything anymore.
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MartinHewitt

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Post Thu Aug 15, 2019 12:23 am

Re: Friction-Fence Locks

Oldfast, did you ever put a safe on its side to improve the feeling of the CP? When I turn the Mosler bolt up the weight of the bolt on the fence makes feeling the CP extremely easy.
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Oldfast

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Post Thu Aug 15, 2019 4:01 am

Re: Friction-Fence Locks

Riyame wrote:.....That finish is actually called "Japanning" or Japanned iron. It was used on a lot of items back in the day as a beautiful durable finish. There were a few varieties and the slow cure one could take months to fully harden.

Link here going into it. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanning

Very interesting little tid-bit there Eric. Thank you!


MartinHewitt wrote:Oldfast, did you ever put a safe on its side to improve the feeling of the CP? When I turn the Mosler bolt up the weight of the bolt on the fence makes feeling the CP extremely easy.

Great 'out-of-the-box' thinking there Martin! Although I've read and heard people speak of this, I've not yet had the need or opportunity to try it. Of course, the safe would have to be of manageable size, but it certainly makes sense that it would improve contact. If you ever do it on a real-world opening, be sure and place your own pointer at 12 o'clock to serve as a new index that won't leave your head all cranked around.
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MartinHewitt

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Post Sun Aug 18, 2019 9:52 pm

Re: Friction-Fence Locks

I did manipulate the OC-5 while watching a movie (Hysteria). The RCP was not that easy to feel, but manipulation was really straight forward. AWR -> W3, LLR -> W2, RLR -> Open. It was set by the previous user to 7/26/73 (pencil inside cover) and I got it open at 7.5/27/72. Because of the movie I did not draw a graph, but just wrote it down in vim and made later a graph for you. Is the OC-5 normally that straight forward?

So, who was born July 26th 1873?
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femurat

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Post Mon Aug 19, 2019 5:09 am

Re: Friction-Fence Locks

You mean 1973? The safe owner!

You used vim to keep track of contact points? Interesting idea. What did you use to make the graph?

Congrats on the opening. It's the first time I hear about opening a safe while watching a movie. Many people brute force padlocks or pick.

Cheers :)
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MartinHewitt

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Post Mon Aug 19, 2019 7:56 am

Re: Friction-Fence Locks

Depending on how long the safe/lock was sitting unused and if it is the owner or the (grand)father of the owner it could be 1873. One lock which was set recently was set to 1946.

I used LibreOffice. Gnuplot might have been a better choice, because there the points can have a position based on the value. LibreOffice apparently sees the x value just as a label, so the graphs are stretched at the blue and red gates.
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femurat

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Post Tue Aug 20, 2019 12:25 pm

Re: Friction-Fence Locks

OK thanks. So you didn't measure CP at 68,75 but the label shows that number anyway. I'll keep it in mind if I try it.

Cheers :)
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MartinHewitt

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Post Tue Aug 20, 2019 1:11 pm

Re: Friction-Fence Locks

The steps of the graph are generally 2.5, but where the gates for W2 and W3 are they are 1.25. So the graph is stretched wide there and I had to fill in points for the other graphs so that there are no single dots with gaps. I don't think it is possible to fix this in LibreOffice, but I am sure it is possible to do it properly in gnuplot.
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MartinHewitt

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Post Tue Aug 20, 2019 1:18 pm

Re: Friction-Fence Locks

That is with default parameters in gnuplot showing real scale.
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femurat

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Post Thu Aug 22, 2019 7:45 am

Re: Friction-Fence Locks

Thanks for taking the time to make the second graph. Looking at the two options, stretching the interesting areas could be a feature rather than a defect. I usually like to draw my graphs on scale paper, sometimes I've used MS Excel on my old PC and sometimes I've used Google Sheets online. I'll make the next graph with LibreOffice (that came by default with my Ubuntu) and let you know how I like it in a real life situation.

Cheers :)
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MartinHewitt

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Post Thu Aug 22, 2019 9:21 am

Re: Friction-Fence Locks

With the stretch the visual sharpness of the gate is IMHO lost.

Ubuntu comes also with gnuplot.
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