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1st Manipulation-Older S&G-Not going well

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iasithol

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Post Sat Jun 10, 2017 4:35 pm

Re: 1st Manipulation-Older S&G-Not going well

Yeah, I'll report back with the cover off. That bump at 19-21 is in there someplace. I need to find out what it is just because I've now spent so much of my life thinking about it.
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Oldfast

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OldddffAASSTT the Spin Master Extraordinaire and American Lock Slayer
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Post Mon Jun 19, 2017 4:59 am

Re: 1st Manipulation-Older S&G-Not going well

First, my condolences. May I ask how long the two of you spent together? Also, I'm glad to see you were able to maybe take your mind off some things during this time with some spinnin'. Sorry I wasn't able to chime in and help much on this one. But to be honest, I really dunno how much more, if any, I could've added that others didn't already. I will say it looks like a difficult spin!

I dunno, looking everything over by compiling all your graphs together in one place,
along with the known combo... maybe there's something we can learn from this yet?

iasithol wrote:80-5-93Image

Image
80-5-93
Image

Image
80-5-93


And lastly...
iasithol wrote:Yeah, I'll report back with the cover off.....

If/when you have the time, please do! I'd love to see the 'rest of the story'.
" Enjoy the journey AS MUCH as the destination."
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iasithol

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Post Mon Jun 19, 2017 5:26 am

Re: 1st Manipulation-Older S&G-Not going well

Oldfast, we had over 30 years together. And she still had her own combo to her own safe. Good fences make good neighbors...

Appreciate your condolences on her passing and on my difficult spin. And I'm glad to hear that it does look difficult as I found it to be so. I'd still appreciate anyone's comments on the graphs you have helpfully compiled. That could only help me learn more about manipulation in general.

I will come back with more info (pictures if helpful) after the back cover is removed. That might be a while still as I'm now busy with what was in the safe (paperwork-no unexpected treasure unfortunately.)

What I have learned, is how to fairly consistently measure and chart a wheel. This should be useful on the next project, which I'm hoping will be a two-hour open but will be happy with two-day. The two-month open tends to become all encompassing which tends to conflict with my natural laziness and desire to NOT spend every evening obsessing over a new procedure for opening an unopened safe.

Causes quit a bit of cognitive dissonance.
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mdc5150

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Post Mon Jun 19, 2017 1:35 pm

Re: 1st Manipulation-Older S&G-Not going well

MartinHewitt wrote:We had here a manipulation of a really cheap lock with wheels made from plastic. That had real burr directly opposite of the gate. On my 6730 the highest point is next to the gate, but still the gate is clearly indicating. Btw. can you reproduce a graph reasonably well? (Location of hills and valleys)

I am still puzzled because of the location of the contact points. All S&G locks I have seen can at least be mounted in right-hand and left-hand position without changing the drop zone.

And: Where are our experts? :)



The only way the drop changes is if the spline key is set up different than the lock is actually mounted.
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tarboxb

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Post Mon Jun 19, 2017 3:00 pm

Re: 1st Manipulation-Older S&G-Not going well

In reality, other than the strangeness of this and the shift of the forbidden zone to an odd place, this really has no negative effect on the function of the lock, right?
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femurat

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Post Mon Jun 19, 2017 3:16 pm

Re: 1st Manipulation-Older S&G-Not going well

tarboxb wrote:In reality, other than the strangeness of this and the shift of the forbidden zone to an odd place, this really has no negative effect on the function of the lock, right?


Right :wink:

EDIT: we are talking about spring loaded fence locks. If it's a gravity fence... you'll never be able to open it again.
Pictures in my posts are gone due to a policy change by my hosting provider that caught me unprepared. I'll work on that. In the meantime left click the image and open it in new tab, you should be able to see the picture, with a selection of unrelated advertising and banners all around it.
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tarboxb

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Post Tue Jun 20, 2017 12:43 am

Re: 1st Manipulation-Older S&G-Not going well

Having a hard time wrapping my head around that one. Aren't they essentially the same except a gravity fence has a heavier lever and no spring? Am I missing something?
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mercurial

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Post Tue Jun 20, 2017 4:57 am

Re: 1st Manipulation-Older S&G-Not going well

tarboxb wrote:Having a hard time wrapping my head around that one. Aren't they essentially the same except a gravity fence has a heavier lever and no spring? Am I missing something?


I think femurat's point is that unless a gravity driven fence lock is mounted with the correct orientation, it won't open because gravity won't be pulling the fence into the wheel pack - eg if the lock was mounted upside down.

I guess such a safe could be opened if the safe itself was turned upside down, placing the lock in it's rightful position.
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femurat

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Post Tue Jun 20, 2017 5:11 am

Re: 1st Manipulation-Older S&G-Not going well

You're right mercurial, you understood perfectly what I meant.
Thanks for putting it in better words.

And yes, if you turn the safe upside down with the lock mounted upside down, you have the lock working again.

Cheers :)
Pictures in my posts are gone due to a policy change by my hosting provider that caught me unprepared. I'll work on that. In the meantime left click the image and open it in new tab, you should be able to see the picture, with a selection of unrelated advertising and banners all around it.
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tarboxb

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Post Tue Jun 20, 2017 11:32 am

Re: 1st Manipulation-Older S&G-Not going well

Oh ok, that makes perfect sense. I thought you meant that if the drive cam were splined differently it would cause it to never open again. Of course, a gravity driven fence would only have the drive cam splined in one place, because as you said it has to be mounted a certain way. Sorry for the confusion.
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