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Help with problem key

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scudo

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Post Sun Apr 20, 2014 12:41 pm

Help with problem key

I hope this is the correct section and apologies for image size but did want to keep as large as possible to view any detail.

This key is from a friends house and although the key opens the lock (euro style) it has to be jiggled a bit, I am hazarding a guess it is badly made (all 3 are the same) I dont have the lock with me as this is a spare key and they are not bothered if I mess up.
For no particular reason I think the part of the key below the red line has something wrong with it , just doesnt look right to me.

Can any of you with experience in keys identify a possible issue with this key?

k4.JPG

k3.JPG

k2.JPG

k1.JPG
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GWiens2001

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Post Sun Apr 20, 2014 12:55 pm

Re: Help with problem key

The cut does look a bit rough. That said, did the lock work with these (or other) keys smoothly before this concern happened? Trying to determine if the problem exists with the keys or the lock.

Gordon
Just when you think you've learned it all, that is when you find you haven't learned anything yet.
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scudo

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Post Sun Apr 20, 2014 1:26 pm

Re: Help with problem key

I dont know, the person rents the property and apparently the keys were cut for them.
My thoughts were also that they looked rough and thought to just lightly go over the cuts with a needle file.

The area marked on the pic below looks like it may be `catching`

k5.jpg
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GWiens2001

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Lock-Goblin-Gordon
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Post Sun Apr 20, 2014 3:34 pm

Re: Help with problem key

I was looking more at the cut two and three flats to the left of the highlighted spot in your most recent picture. Would try flattening those places first, before working on the ramps between cuts.

Gordon
Just when you think you've learned it all, that is when you find you haven't learned anything yet.
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scudo

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Post Sun Apr 20, 2014 4:03 pm

Re: Help with problem key

Gordon, Just so I am looking at the correct cuts, does your thinking align with how I have numbered them?

k4 - Copy.JPG
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Farmerfreak

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Post Sun Apr 20, 2014 4:13 pm

Re: Help with problem key

Without having the lock in hand it could be near impossible to tell for sure. But as a general rule, if it turns stiff it's too shallow. If you need to giggle it to get it to turn and it turns easy, it's cut too deep. Spacing could be an issue as well.

If the key doesn't go in/out of the lock easy it could be the roughness of the key, it could be lube, it could be a lock that needs to be worn in (cheap locks have that issue..), or it could be worn out.
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scudo

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Post Sun Apr 20, 2014 4:27 pm

Re: Help with problem key

The key goes in and out ok when you try and turn it, it feels like it snags on a certain part, you then wiggle the key around and it gets past the `obstruction` and then it is smooth again. At least thats how I would describe it.
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Oldfast

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OldddffAASSTT the Spin Master Extraordinaire and American Lock Slayer
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Post Sun Apr 20, 2014 6:23 pm

Re: Help with problem key

Not sayin' this is the problem but...
Oh man, those cuts are absolutely atrocious! :shock:
Is this the result of using a cutting wheel well beyond its' life?
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10ringo10

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Post Sun Apr 20, 2014 7:59 pm

Re: Help with problem key

who chopped these keys my advice ! take them back and demand a full refund nu 4 cut on the key as been cut to wide it stands out a mile :smile:
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Oldfast

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OldddffAASSTT the Spin Master Extraordinaire and American Lock Slayer
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Post Sun Apr 20, 2014 8:07 pm

Re: Help with problem key

10ringo10 wrote:who chopped these keys my advice ! take them back and demand a full refund

NO SHIT! I for one would be ashamed :oops: to let that leave my lock room... even if I did it for FREE. lol
" Enjoy the journey AS MUCH as the destination."
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10ringo10

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Post Sun Apr 20, 2014 8:17 pm

Re: Help with problem key

Oldfast wrote:
10ringo10 wrote:who chopped these keys my advice ! take them back and demand a full refund

NO SHIT! I for one would be ashamed :oops: to let that leave my lock room... even if I did it for FREE. lol


The problem is the spacing the 4th cut throws the 6 cut out ! it can easily be fixed if you required just take a file and make the last cut on key wider not deeper

this will solve the problem

The first cut is always the most important as the spacing as to work out exactly from this point ! a simple slip in the vice can cause this to happen and is a miss cut key
and it is always best to check the key been copied if present ! before cutting so you can make that adjustment :smile:

Cutting keys from photos plays a big part in a locksmiths world these days so the key will not always be present and is another skill set to learn !
Last edited by 10ringo10 on Sun Apr 20, 2014 9:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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GWiens2001

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Lock-Goblin-Gordon
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Post Sun Apr 20, 2014 9:41 pm

Re: Help with problem key

Looking at the key blown up, think the ramps between 4-3 and 2-1 need to be filed a little, as they look like they may be catching the key pins as the key goes in. You already pointed out the ramp on 2-1 as suspect. It would also match your description of the key binding in the lock, and a little jiggling allows the key to go in the rest of the way, and it then works smootly.

That said, the key just plain sucks as for quality of cut. Yes, that 4 cut is too wide, and 10ringo10 is right about that point as well.

Gordon
Just when you think you've learned it all, that is when you find you haven't learned anything yet.
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jones

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Post Mon Jun 16, 2014 9:31 pm

Re: Help with problem key

I wanna say the loud, funny words too,
If you look at the space between the key shoulder and the first cut (pics 3+4) you can see the machine is cutting too deeply. If you put the key in the lock and then lift the whole key, while you turn the cylinder, you can see if it has been cut too low. I see this on many hardware store key machines, they simply do not know how to accurately adjust their key machine.

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