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Re: Getting started with manipulation

PostPosted: Thu Feb 19, 2015 8:13 am
by femurat
You're welcome Alexander_Case. Good luck with your new journey, and let us see your progress...

Cheers :)

Re: Getting started with manipulation

PostPosted: Thu Feb 19, 2015 9:41 pm
by Papa Gleb
Femurat, thank you very much for the write up and link. I am starting to re read everything now that I mounted my lock. I wanted to ask if you have any tips on the mounting. I think I got the job done right but want to make sure before I invest hours as I was already close to that. Good thing I checked the dial before finishing the installation because it was rubbing on the dial ring so I made some adjustments and now everything feels smooth.

Re: Getting started with manipulation

PostPosted: Fri Feb 20, 2015 8:43 am
by femurat
Well the main thing you need to pay attention to is to center the lock and the dial. Looks like you already know that. If the dial rotates freely, without friction, you're ready to start. This video is very helpful.
Another thing: make sure the lock works. Ask somebody to open it with the correct combo (without telling it to you).

Good luck :)

Re: Getting started with manipulation

PostPosted: Fri Feb 20, 2015 3:26 pm
by Papa Gleb
Haha that is the actually video I followed step by step.

I dont have the combo on this S&G and the original owner didnt either. It was a rescue as 2 drilled or burglarized safes were going into the junker. You might have actually seen the thread a few weeks back. The locks do have some wear on them but the internals look intact and clean.

Re: Getting started with manipulation

PostPosted: Fri Feb 20, 2015 3:35 pm
by femurat
Yep I saw that thread. Well just start dialing then :)

Re: Getting started with manipulation

PostPosted: Fri Jun 05, 2015 4:31 pm
by rodneybu0
Was taught to manipulate the third wheel on its own first as that is often the first wheel to indicate anyway, then try wheels one and two together and when you have a good indication run the number and work out which of the wheels the number is on . Then you have 2 numbers and it is just a matter of dialling the known numbers and a test on the third until the lock opens.

Re: Getting started with manipulation

PostPosted: Mon Jun 08, 2015 10:15 am
by femurat
Hi rodneybu0,

that's what I heard in a video about manipulation by Mark Bates some time ago.
To learn manipulation I still suggest to use the method I describe. Once you've got the hang of it every shortcut is welcome.

Cheers :)

Re: Getting started with manipulation

PostPosted: Fri Jun 23, 2017 11:59 am
by femurat
Hello Jerry, let me quote our friend datagram to answer your question

datagram wrote:All of the standard S&G models are good for practice:

S&G 6730/6741 - Three wheel practice locks
S&G 6731 - Four wheel practice lock
S&G 664x - Three wheel practice locks with better gate tolerance
S&G 6630 - Manipulation resistant (false gates) three wheel, but NOT a Group 1, it's a "2M"

LaGard 3330 is another common practice lock, but their other models can be very challenging (they use floating fence & cam mechanisms). The S&G 29xx/84xx/85xx are all Group 1 and manipulation resistant...not good for beginners.

dg


Hope this helps :)

Re: Getting started with manipulation

PostPosted: Fri Jun 23, 2017 3:50 pm
by MartinHewitt
The 6642 has false gates and the 6630 false gates and a lever nose roller!

Re: Getting started with manipulation

PostPosted: Thu Dec 28, 2017 7:33 pm
by castle 2
I have a LaGard group 2 4wheel 1800 series lock, which I have been having problems with getting even any information for : is that a suitable lock to be going along with?

Re: Getting started with manipulation

PostPosted: Thu Dec 28, 2017 8:26 pm
by MartinHewitt
A Group 2 should be doable, but I have never heard of a LG 1800. Do you have photos for us?

Re: Getting started with manipulation

PostPosted: Fri Jan 26, 2018 4:26 am
by castle 2
[quote="MartinHewitt"]A Group 2 should be doable, but I have never heard of a LG 1800. Do you have photos for us?[/quote][quote="MartinHewitt"]A Group 2 should be doable, but I have never heard of a LG 1800. Do you have photos for us?[/quote]
Indeed, apologies for the low quality of the images, my phone has a Goblin with a chewed up pencil living inside it as it's 'camera' joke of a setting...

https://imgur.com/gallery/nBLCR

Re: Getting started with manipulation

PostPosted: Fri Jan 26, 2018 9:19 pm
by MartinHewitt
Got now one myself. See viewtopic.php?f=100&t=12498 . I don't think this is a good start for manipulation. LG locks are tricky and with the fourth wheel the beginner has a lot of dialing before he get's his first success. But with persistence it is doable.

Re: Getting started with manipulation

PostPosted: Fri Feb 09, 2018 7:01 pm
by Eazy123
I'm having issues here - I set my SG 6730 to 40, 50, 60 so that I knew the combo and would be able to tell if what I'm doing is correct, but while the first chart I did showed 50 as a gate, when I did the wheel # test, both high and low tests clearly showed wheel #1 as the conclusion, when I know it's #2. I did both tests three times and they came up the same. What could I be doing wrong?

Re: Getting started with manipulation

PostPosted: Fri Feb 09, 2018 7:53 pm
by femurat
If you made the high low tests with numbers of other gates they give unexpected results. Which numbers did you use for the tests?

Cheers :)