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Anyone use the Sparrows American Bypass Tool?

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DR2

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Post Wed Aug 21, 2013 7:27 pm

Re: Anyone use the Sparrows American Bypass Tool?

I reckon about a dozen of them. And, none of them were key-retaining or had the disc/wafer to prevent the bypass. It's just a bum tool. When I get a Peterson, I'll just file and sand the Sparrows to fit according to the Peterson Pattern of the concept.
"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic." ~ Arthur C. Clarke's Third Law of Prediction
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DR2

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Post Thu Aug 22, 2013 6:52 pm

Re: Anyone use the Sparrows American Bypass Tool?

Partial update. Scored a AM700 Tool and instantly popped an American A1100 that I purchased from XEO a couple weeks ago. The "flag" of "golf club" on this tool is a lot smaller than the Sparrows.
"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic." ~ Arthur C. Clarke's Third Law of Prediction
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Oldfast

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OldddffAASSTT the Spin Master Extraordinaire and American Lock Slayer
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Post Fri Aug 23, 2013 5:29 am

Re: Anyone use the Sparrows American Bypass Tool?

DR2 wrote:
Oldfast wrote:Any new word on this DR2? I have both Sparrows' & Petersons'
bypass tool. Admittedly, I've not used either of them a whole
shitload of times. I do have some thoughts on each though, but...

I'm curious... how many locks in total do you think you've tried now?


I reckon about a dozen of them. And, none of them were key-retaining or had the disc/wafer to prevent the bypass. It's just a bum tool.
When I get a Peterson, I'll just file and sand the Sparrows to fit according to the Peterson Pattern of the concept.

I can appreciate your frustration, really. And I know this is probably not what you want to hear...lol... but,

Regardless of whether you're using Sparrows or Petersons, these bypass tools simply do not work 100% of the time.
They're similar to the Silver Bullet Set for Masters - sometimes they work beautifully, and other times they don't.
Hard telling exactly why this is... it could be due to any number of things I suppose. Age and condition of the
lock, wear and tear, new vs. old, variances from part to part, tolerances, etc, etc... who knows really.

For example, when I first seen your thread here a couple weeks ago... it prompted me to go in the lockroom.
I randomly grabbed a dozen Americans. All of em' were 1105's. Some fairly old, others quite new. Also, as I
mentioned - I've not used these an enormous amount... so you have to also take that into consideration.
Just like Alphablue mentioned, technique is certainly a factor when it comes to successfully using these.

At any rate, out of 12 locks.... results were:
Peterson's: OPEN 5 .... FAIL 7
Sparrows' : OPEN 7 .... FAIL 5

Very unscientific way of really drawing any sound conclusions, I know. But it is what it is.
You could say, in a VERY rough way, success rate is around half the time (give or take).

DR2, I'd love to hear your thoughts on Peterson's tool as you continue to use it. Here's why I'm curious.

Pictured here (black handle) is the very first one I purchased from Peterson quite some time ago.
The handle is both comfortable and solid. More importantly though is the working end of the tool -
I'm not a metals man, but it was comprised of what seemed to be a fairly strong metal. And to top
it off, the quality control really shined through, as both the shaft and tip shape looked to be
machined to some very precise specs. Overall great tool. BTW, the missing tip is MY fault. lol

Image
Not long after, I decided to purchase another one from them, expecting to receive the same product.
What I received though (gray handle) was much different from the original one I had purchased before.

Obviously, the handle was changed - fair enough. I wasn't too concerned with that. In fact, in terms of
storage in a pick case, it's better actually. However, the working end of the tool was now made of a
much weaker material than the first. And, the quality control just wasn't there. The shaft was no
where near straight, making for alot of friction going down the keyway. Also, the shaft was now
longer, which actually draws from the amount of torque it can withstand. I try not to judge too
quickly, but I have to say this second purchase was a bit of a let down compared to the first.

And here is "Sparrows By-Pass Driver"
Image

As you seen in my quick, unscientific approach of testing a dozen locks, I was able to open
two additional locks with this by-pass driver that I was unable to open with the Peterson tool.
I do not think this was due to the design of the 'flag'. Instead, what made the difference I think,
was the additional force I was able to exert on this tool without fear of breaking/bending it.

This tool is solid. I don't think you could make one any stronger, yet still effective.
On the working end... comprised of good, strong material, & the machining looks precise.
Also notice the length of the shaft is ONLY as long as it has to be, adding even more strength.

By no means is this meant as a fair, comprehensive, all-inclusive review or anything like that.
More so, it's just some quick conclusions (or opinions rather) I've come to based on my brief
experience with these three tools.
With that said, here's what I'm thinking....

FUNCTIONALITY: Out of a trial run of 12 locks, Peterson opened 5... Sparrows opened 7.
So at the very least, I think it would be safe to say that these tools work EQUALLY well.

DURABILITY: Sparrows By-Pass Driver wins by a very large margin in this category.
I have serious doubts about the life-span of Peterson's American bypass tool.
And for this reason, if/when I ever purchase another one... it will be Sparrows.

Don't get me wrong, I LOVE Peterson tools and alot of the innovative things they put out!!! But when it comes to
this particular tool and their current version they're selling (versus their previous), it just doesn't cut it for me.
Why'd they change to a weaker material? Why was the shaft all bent up? And why did they make it longer?
I was impressed with their original version. Honestly, I'm not sure the reasoning behind the changes.
" Enjoy the journey AS MUCH as the destination."
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GringoLocksmith

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Post Fri Aug 23, 2013 10:20 am

Re: Anyone use the Sparrows American Bypass Tool?

oldfast-

In your experiment, how many of the Americans were opened by either the Peterson or the Sparrow? That is, were the five that you opened with the Peterson also opened with the Sparrow, or between the two tools did you manage to open more than seven locks?
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Oldfast

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OldddffAASSTT the Spin Master Extraordinaire and American Lock Slayer
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Post Fri Aug 23, 2013 4:49 pm

Re: Anyone use the Sparrows American Bypass Tool?

Ah yes, thanks for asking. I should've been a little more clear. Lemme put it this way...

The first 5, I was able to open using EITHER tool. The next 2, I was able to open with Sparrows, but
could not manage to pop em' with the Peterson. And the remaining 5 would not yield to EITHER tool.
" Enjoy the journey AS MUCH as the destination."
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DR2

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Post Fri Aug 23, 2013 9:03 pm

Re: Anyone use the Sparrows American Bypass Tool?

And these were all non-key retaining and verified no security wafer to prevent the bypass, right? I'm just checking (anyone can make a mistake) and will respond to your more in-depth response up above, which I greatly appreciate. 8-)

Oldfast wrote:Ah yes, thanks for asking. I should've been a little more clear. Lemme put it this way...

The first 5, I was able to open using EITHER tool. The next 2, I was able to open with Sparrows, but
could not manage to pop em' with the Peterson. And the remaining 5 would not yield to EITHER tool.
"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic." ~ Arthur C. Clarke's Third Law of Prediction
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Oldfast

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OldddffAASSTT the Spin Master Extraordinaire and American Lock Slayer
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Post Sat Aug 24, 2013 2:09 am

Re: Anyone use the Sparrows American Bypass Tool?

Now that you mention it, I never actually looked.

I'll take a look at the five that couldn't be opened
when I get a chance... just to be absolutely sure.
" Enjoy the journey AS MUCH as the destination."
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Oldfast

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OldddffAASSTT the Spin Master Extraordinaire and American Lock Slayer
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Post Sat Aug 24, 2013 11:35 pm

Re: Anyone use the Sparrows American Bypass Tool?

DR2 wrote:And these were all non-key retaining and verified no security wafer to prevent the bypass, right? I'm just checking (anyone can make a mistake)
and will respond to your more in-depth response up above, which I greatly appreciate. 8-)
So the five locks I was unable to open with EITHER tool
are indeed NON-key retaining and have NO wafers.

Also, I haven't done this in a while now, since I don't really use these tools often...
but I use to keep the working ends polished as smooth as possible, then leave a
very light coating of lubrication (I use Tri-Flow). Whether this actually makes a
difference or not... I don't know. But it certainly can't hurt.
(I think Alphablue already made mention of this too)
" Enjoy the journey AS MUCH as the destination."
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DR2

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Post Sun Aug 25, 2013 3:10 am

Re: Anyone use the Sparrows American Bypass Tool?

Oldfast wrote:
Regardless of whether you're using Sparrows or Petersons, these bypass tools simply do not work 100% of the time.

They're similar to the Silver Bullet Set for Masters - sometimes they work beautifully, and other times they don't.

Hard telling exactly why this is...it could be due to any number of things I suppose. Age and condition of the
lock, wear and tear, new vs. old, variances from part to part, tolerances, etc, etc...who knows really.


Well, sometimes a lock doesn't seem to want to open when you are picking it, either. Damned things! :D

DR2, I'd love to hear your thoughts on Peterson's tool as you continue to use it. Here's why I'm curious.


Actually, I don't have one of the Petersons yet. I don't think that I said that I did in this thread anywhere. I just had the Sparrows until I landed an AM700 Tool which was the first commercial bypass driver for American Padlocks available.

Obviously, the handle was changed - fair enough. I wasn't too concerned with that. In fact, in terms of storage in a pick case, it's better actually.


Indeed, I think that was a good move for that reason.

However, the working end of the tool was now made of a much weaker material than the first. And, the quality control just wasn't there. The shaft was no where near straight, making for alot of friction going down the keyway. Also, the shaft was now longer, which actually draws from the amount of torque it can withstand. I try not to judge too quickly, but I have to say this second purchase was a bit of a let down compared to the first.


I spoke with Ken at Peterson, at length, about this and he has viewed your comments concerning the tools. He said the company (Peterson) has went through some issues with the AD-B Tools. The person that was making the tools in-house went through some health issues which Ken is obviously not at liberty to speak about at great length, but it was a real medical issue involving serious surgery that negatively impacted this Gentleman's role in the manufacturing process of these tools. He has had the surgery and is recovering and all of that has been sorted out. A large quantity of the inserts was made with the correct diameter but incorrect type of wire in that the wire was not up to the desired specifications and two machines used in the process were incorrectly set up which led to this problem.

Ken is now reworking the whole thing and every tool is being dropped into an American Padlock and being used to open it before they are placed into stock to be sold. He is also in the middle of working on a new line of Dimple Picks using similar tooling. So, with all of this, you even get an exclusive. :)

This tool is solid. I don't think you could make one any stronger, yet still effective. On the working end...comprised of good, strong material, & the machining looks precise. Also notice the length of the shaft is ONLY as long as it has to be, adding even more strength.


The Sparrows Bypass Tool is built like a tank and the actual steel used is amazingly strong. I know because I have really cranked on this tool and I have not really bent it to a degree you can see with the naked eye, anyway.

The handle I am not fond of and the tool weighs more than it has to. But the actual strength of the tool is outstanding. But there is some other problem involved. I can't believe that over the range of locks I have, Americans, that the only thing I have been able to open is a "Guard Dog" knockoff of an American 700 Series.

DURABILITY: Sparrows By-Pass Driver wins by a very large margin in this category.
I have serious doubts about the life-span of Peterson's American bypass tool.
And for this reason, if/when I ever purchase another one... it will be Sparrows.

Don't get me wrong, I LOVE Peterson tools and alot of the innovative things they put out!!! But when it comes to this particular tool and their current version they're selling (versus their previous), it just doesn't cut it for me.

Why'd they change to a weaker material? Why was the shaft all bent up? And why did they make it longer?

I was impressed with their original version. Honestly, I'm not sure the reasoning behind the changes.


Well, hopefully you will give Peterson International another crack at it after being made aware of what is going on.
"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic." ~ Arthur C. Clarke's Third Law of Prediction
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Oldfast

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OldddffAASSTT the Spin Master Extraordinaire and American Lock Slayer
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Post Sun Aug 25, 2013 2:21 pm

Re: Anyone use the Sparrows American Bypass Tool?

DR2 (and Ken, if you're reading this).... Thank you SO much for relaying all of this info!!!!

We're ALL human. Shit happens. Perfectly understandable.
I don't know how many of these made it out into the public,
but I think it is ABSOLUTELY CRUCIAL that we are all aware of this....
DR2 wrote:I spoke with Ken at Peterson, at length, about this and he has viewed your comments concerning the tools. He said the company (Peterson) has went through some issues with the AD-B Tools. The person that was making the tools in-house went through some health issues which Ken is obviously not at liberty to speak about at great length, but it was a real medical issue involving serious surgery that negatively impacted this Gentleman's role in the manufacturing process of these tools. He has had the surgery and is recovering and all of that has been sorted out. A large quantity of the inserts was made with the correct diameter but incorrect type of wire in that the wire was not up to the desired specifications and two machines used in the process were incorrectly set up which led to this problem.
Aside from the gentlemen's serious health issues... I'm really quite happy to hear all this. I am.
Knowing the condition of the tool I received is due to some mishaps, makes all the difference in the world.

DR2 wrote:Well, hopefully you will give Peterson International another crack at it after being made aware of what is going on.
I MOST CERTAINLY will.

Thanks again for checking on this DR2. Much appreciated.
" Enjoy the journey AS MUCH as the destination."
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DR2

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Post Sun Aug 25, 2013 2:47 pm

Re: Anyone use the Sparrows American Bypass Tool?

No sweat man. I have another friend who owns his own business and carries some Sparrows stuff, the Bypass Driver being one such item, and I don't think that my Sparrows Bypass Tool is representative of all of their tools, either. The only thing I was really disappointed with was being pointed at directions that I had already digested about use of the tool. When I end up getting a Peterson Bypass Tool, I'll take pics of the Sparrows, Peterson and the Lockmasters side by side so people can see the differences. I think people will be most surprised at the Lockmaster's type actually. There is no doubt in my mind that a working Sparrows Bypass Driver is going to be good for hundreds, if not thousands, of openings and I know for a fact because of materials and manufacturing that the same cannot be said of the Lockmasters AM700 or AM100 Tools.
"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic." ~ Arthur C. Clarke's Third Law of Prediction
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DR2

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Post Wed Sep 04, 2013 1:41 am

Re: Anyone use the Sparrows American Bypass Tool?

New information. Was talking to Ken again about this, the gray handled tool is actually not for bypassing Americans, it is for bypassing Euro-cylinders, that's why it is longer. Ken said to send it back to him and he'll set you up proper. :)

He has had some pretty bad problems over the last few months and he is in the process of sorting all of that out. Some of it has been mentioned, some of it has not been discussed. He is going to Britain for the Master Locksmith Assoc. show in about a week, so, give him time to get sorted out after he returns and he'll fix you up.
"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic." ~ Arthur C. Clarke's Third Law of Prediction
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kazemita

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Post Fri Jan 02, 2015 8:02 pm

Re: Anyone use the Sparrows American Bypass Tool?

I used the sparrow bypass tool (2nd version as they call it) and it worked like a charm on the non-key-retaining 1100 series American padlock. The item was less than half the price of its competitor so I chose it. Perhaps, it is worth mentioning that these tools (both made by Peterson or Sparrow) are not supposed to work with key-retaining padlocks. My experience also shows that the keyway for some American Padlock 747 models is made smaller compared to 700 and 1100 series such that this tool will not really fit in.
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ckc123

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Post Mon Apr 13, 2015 3:58 am

Re: Anyone use the Sparrows American Bypass Tool?

Like a lot of others, I didn't have luck with the bypass tool when I first got it..

after playing around with it, I managed to get it fine tuned and it works now..

When I got the bypass tool, I noticed the following:

1) The tool would only fit in one position in the lock which was at the top of the keyway, and having to push the key pins up to get it in..
2) it was a VERY tight fit. (shaft of the tool was too thick)
3) The top of the keyway was NOT the position the flag needs to be in for the bypass to work properly
4) the flag was a hair too long to fit the curve of the keyway at the bottom where it was supposed to fit

What I did to fix it..

1) Took sand paper to the shaft to make it a bit thinner.. so it would fit in the middle of the shaft
2) made the flag a bit shorter so that the flag would not hit the right right of the keyway when inserted at the mid point.
3) polished it on the polishing wheel to a mirror whine..

now it work 100% of the time..
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Papa Gleb

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Post Mon Apr 13, 2015 7:25 pm

Re: Anyone use the Sparrows American Bypass Tool?

CKC show some pic of the finish tools plz.

This tool is just like any tools we use including the average pick. Remember the time you received your first pick... chances are you couldnt open a Master lock at first but with some practice it was a different story. The same applies here so having the tool does not guarantee opened lock, at least at first. I never had the Peterson tool but I do own the Sparrows with the black handle which is their newer model I assume. The tool didnt work at first because it had a hard time getting into the keyway so I had to sand it down a bit and once it fit I thought I was in but no. I had to watch and read more info on the tool until I understood what was happening inside and sanded it some more to make a sharper point. After that the tool worked, still not as easy as you may have seen but you have to understand what the tool does to the cam and this is why Peterson informs us that if the tool will be used on the same lock over and over again the cam will need to be replaced because the hard steel is bashing into the soft brass cam but on the same hand if the cam has already been used, a groove forms perfect for the tool thus the tool will work with easy. This said yes the tool will need more work at a new lock but keep at it and the tool will make a groove slowly which will then allow the tool full entrance in between the cam and actuator. The sparrows tool has a nice thick round handle which feels great but doesnt fit well into the cases so I wanted to flatten it down. I contacted sparrows who informed that its all one solid piece of metal which can be ground down. I still plan to do so but the reason I stopped is because I dont want to lose the grip coating that is on the tool so I am still deciding. PS I have a can of plasti-dip which is great but the coat it leaves is so sticky just by the nature of the rubber that its hard to fit into anything either. The can states that if you want a thicker coat to add non-slip grit. Does anyone know what that is? I googled with on luck, checked my local stores with no luck.

Typed this all to fast so forgive any grammatical errors etc.
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