"The Ultimate Lock"

[.45cal]

If the reason you used such a common key way was to keep the price down you could always make it LFIC compatible then the consumer could pay for the security they want

[the lockpickkid]

If the reason you used such a common key way was to keep the price down you could always make it LFIC compatible then the consumer could pay for the security they want

That's actually a very good idea, makes for a wide variety of different locks that could be used, even high security.

[KokomoLock]

The way the lock is set up, you can pretty much put in any key in knob cylinder you want from kwikset to medeco. I was on the phone with Ultimate Lock for over an hour today and from what I can gather they are not concerned with the key cylinder period. They know it can be picked, they know it can be bumped, people are not getting in that way. They are all about home invasion, they told me a lot of their installs they dont even use the outside key portion of the lock, just mount the inside portion with the secondary bolt to the top and or bottom corner of the door and screw the 3.5 inch strike plate screws into the header. I do believe it would take forever to kick one of these in, if it is even possible, which we are not about on this forum, and don't think they quite understood this at the beginning. I don't know how they can still market it pick and bump proof when they know both can be done. Everyone at Ultimate Lock was very nice and professional with me and answered every question I had, except for coming out and saying why they still use pick proof and bump proof.

[the lockpickkid]

I have a firm belief that you should never promise something to a consumer when essentially it is false. It really makes me mad when companies do this. Saying that this lock is pick and bump proof, is a lie to get consumers who are already panicked about bumping to buy the product.

[UltimateOwnage]

Komo, your professionalism is one to idol. I thank you personally. Now to answer cowboy's remark.

(clears throat and swig some beer....clears throat)

If the feature is engaged (minus that drill trick you guys figured out) the door cannot be open.

When we demo the product, we actually set up a door and allow any who is willing to Kick, bang, batter in trying to get the door open.

Komo has it right on (which you are one very smart cookie) that its about Home Invasion.

Now someone coming with a drill, HAS TO KNOW FIRST where to drill exactly.

So ask your self, you watch Denver smash the Dolphins when (BRRRRRRRRRRRRRR) you hear what you know is a drill coming in your door.

Setting down your beer, you sigh. Annoyed that some fool has decided to disturb your football game that you now have to shoot some one trying to...(clears throat) Drill through your door.

I mean really. If you are out walking the dog or cat or alliagator or what ever ( I use to walk my Iguana) you would sort of look at someone side ways if you could tell they are up to no good....drilling a door.

Wouldn't you?

And yes, I did under estimate this website (bow down to the all powerful lockpickidd) and am humble to each of you.

Especially to you Komo, Gutterclown and Harvey.

Thank you for allowing me to be part of this debate. Because of you, if you think about it, you do save lives.

You GUYS (hic) are awesome (hic) I luv you guys

seriously, ya'll are fun. Have to take you out to my deer lease next season or go fishing. (lowpickidd get that look out your eyes, I'm a married man)

Thanks ya'll

[ToolyMcgee]

Komo, and cowboy? You loud mouthed half-assed carnival barker. You have some nerve posting this sarcastic shit before your million dollar campaign in a forum that defeated your shit cylinder in less than 24 hours. The gaul... who gave you permission, to do this? Your locks price, is ALL to cover advertising cost. Iron/zinc alloy, is pot metal!

[UltimateOwnage]

I don't get it? There is no zinc in our locks...and aren't there suppose to be rides in a carnival?

[s1deshowmick]

Yes sir, there are rides at the carnival and we just took one hell of a ride at the ULTIMATE LOCK carnival.

You are right about one thing,

You just don't get it.

[.45cal]

I appreciate you coming to our forum to try and defend your "ultimate lock" but do not start calling people names especially after you commend someone for their professionalism! This is a forum to discuss lockpicking and you are a guest don't forget that.

[UltimateOwnage]

I appreciate you coming to our forum to try and defend your "ultimate lock" but do not start calling people names especially after you commend someone for their professionalism! This is a forum to discuss lockpicking and you are a guest don't forget that.

Just playing around man, nothing serious. I got spanked and that pretty much sums it up.

Relax, have a cookie.

[magician59]

I have been thoroughly entertained by reading this thread. It seems that it is far too easy for a topic to get out of control when there is misunderstanding amongst the readers and posters (see for example some of my own contributions in defense of certain locks). I know quality when I see it. I've been in the industry since the Big Bang. I worked for almost two decades in a local school district. We used to ask a question to sales reps, who were trying to sell us the "strongest" locks on the market: "Oh, yeah? Did you test it in the schools?". To quote one of my supervisors, "We have school kids who can tear up an anvil with a toothbrush handle." So, I would like to know what materials this Ultimate Lock is made of, and how it is attached to the door. I believe, in most cases, a high skill like picking is not "wasted" on residential break-ins, so a good quality cylinder with tight tolerances will suffice. But if a lock can be knocked off a door or peeled apart with ease, you might as well make room for it on a shelf at Walmart.

[UltimateOwnage]

I have been thoroughly entertained by reading this thread. It seems that it is far too easy for a topic to get out of control when there is misunderstanding amongst the readers and posters (see for example some of my own contributions in defense of certain locks). I know quality when I see it. I've been in the industry since the Big Bang. I worked for almost two decades in a local school district. We used to ask a question to sales reps, who were trying to sell us the "strongest" locks on the market: "Oh, yeah? Did you test it in the schools?". To quote one of my supervisors, "We have school kids who can tear up an anvil with a toothbrush handle." So, I would like to know what materials this Ultimate Lock is made of, and how it is attached to the door. I believe, in most cases, a high skill like picking is not "wasted" on residential break-ins, so a good quality cylinder with tight tolerances will suffice. But if a lock can be knocked off a door or peeled apart with ease, you might as well make room for it on a shelf at Walmart.

Walmart wants like a million dollars to pay for advertising. I don't have a problem with it being on Walmart or Target shelves. Its a recommended install, not DIY other wise we don't stand behind the claim.

Its still resistant to kick ins, and again. If the feature is engaged, it cannot be opened with just a pick or bump key.

Granted if you have a drill, know where to drill then yes. ANY lock is useless apparently.

But 99.99% criminals do NOT know where to drill and do NOT have the talents as the active members here do.

Just being realistic here. Our lock is about preventing victims of Home Invasions, which our lock dose this.

How of you have actually been to our website?

www.theultimatelock.com

Minus the whole "drill" episode the Ultimate Lock is the best lock out there. No other lock utilizes the frame and door like ours does. No other product can claim to be kick resistant and bump proof ( drill a hole is NOT bumping) like our lock.

Wrong or right?

[s1deshowmick]

So you said,

"Granted if you have a drill, know where to drill then yes. ANY lock is useless apparently.

But 99.99% criminals do NOT know where to drill and do NOT have the talents as the active members here do."

But apparently they practice for it.

You said,

"It takes 1.7 seconds to enter a home in a Kick in. The criminals that do this train for it, practice it. They know what they are doing, how to do it and get it done."

Surely if a criminal was going to go to the bother of physicaly training to break into my house with me in it, why wouldn't they go to the trouble of finding an easier way to get my door open, such as drilling.

Or for the poor unsuspecting sap like me, sitting at home drinking a beer and scratching my nuts while watching the football, why wouldn't they just knock on the freaking door.

And apart from the whole drill aspect, the ULTIMATE LOCK is just another lock.

[UltimateOwnage]

well, any lock is just another lock. But that is just it. It took Komo over two minutes, with HIM KNOWING where to drill. Which is NOT bumping or picking. Its drilling.

Now as for knocking on the door. This removes element of surprise. One you are now alerted to their presences, two you don't know 'who' they are. So you just not going to invite them in, offer them a bear and ask them what they think of Pharr.

If you did...you tube it so we can put it on America's Funniest Videos.

Again I'm focus on the security of the device and to what criminals are doing right now and have been for years.

They ban in groups of four to five and KICK the door in. Not a window, not the chimney but just the door.

No drills, just knives and guns. The threat is real. I feel that this lock Ultimate Lock offers the home owner assurance that he and his family are NOT going to be kicked in, if the feature is engaged, then nor will it be picked or have a bump key used.

You keep forgetting that you have an advantage over other consumers with your knowledge of locks. So your standard might be equivalent to that of a Bank Vault.

Compared to all the other locks out there, what rate would our lock stand for?

Now I know competition is rough in that we are fairly new, but again we offer what no other lock offers, and you are right. We are just a simple lock. But designed better, made better and offer more.

[Solomon]

Now as for knocking on the door. This removes element of surprise. One you are now alerted to their presences, two you don't know 'who' they are. So you just not going to invite them in, offer them a bear and ask them what they think of Pharr.

If you invited them in, it wouldn't be a home invasion. You're looking at this the wrong way; you clearly have no understanding of how a criminal thinks (which is why the majority of security companies fail to see weaknesses in their products before they hit the market). They're actually more likely to knock the door than they are to start kicking at it... after all you could be sitting in your bedroom with a loaded gun at arms length, and by the time they find you, you'll be lying in wait for them to walk in front of the door!

I alluded to this at least twice already, so hopefully I can draw your attention towards it properly this time. If your product is all about home invasion then you MUST address this form of attack. It's far more common, but for the sake of argument let's say nobody has ever thought of it before. It sure as hell WOULD become a problem as soon as people started realising "hey we can't bust down the doors while they're closed properly". It needs to be countered.

Knocking the door doesn't remove the element of surprise. They simply knock the door, wait until the owner opens up to talk to them, then BAM! They shoulder their way in. Sure, common sense dictates that you shouldn't open your door to a stranger late at night - but home invasions don't necessarily happen after dark, and you should also consider that most people aren't constantly in a high state of awareness. Providing the person at the door isn't wearing a ski mask or acting really suspiciously, they will open the door a little to see what they want. After all, you can't talk through the door cos that'd make you look like a crazy person.

A regular chain isn't going to stand up to this kind of attack, so your lock needs to have some kind of accompanying safety latch so that the bad guys can't do this. It's something you should seriously consider, and it's pretty inexpensive. As it stands, your lock is fantastic in terms of strength. Like I said before though, this is removed once the door is even slightly ajar, so you need something the owner can have in place if they don't know who is calling. That way, the door will remain secure even when opened slightly... so they can talk to the person outside while keeping the door secure at the same time.