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Re: Doens't seem like a good idea to me ...

PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2017 10:09 pm
by Oldfast
Pick-Fu wrote:She was not happy to say the least, so I custom pinned all her locks with better bidding (bitting?) and some good security pins....

Bidding... is for ebay. Bitting is for keys :D Xeo, after laughing some, had to clarify this for me too when I first came around.
Not that it matters much... we know what you're saying. Just thought you might genuinely be asking/wondering.

As mentioned, most thieves will be of the 'smash & grab' type... but NEVER underestimate the power of greed.
You'd be surprised the lengths people are willing to go for a free payday (or, there's always the possibility they
have far more sinister plans than theft!). I have no doubt that some people (albeit few) would indeed take the
time to learn something like this. So it may be a small risk, but why create a risk?! So not a good idea, no.

Many keys, especially the more popular brands like Schlage and Kwikset, can be readily decoded by sight.
At one time I had a pretty keen eye for it. I had actually accumulated a bunch of these two brands, placed
them all on two large key rings, then used them kinda like flashcards to hone my eye.

Funny story from a few years back; There's a good friend of mine who I'd see on a weekly bases at a meeting
I attend. Every week he'd sit down next to me and flop his keys up on the table. Out of the small mess of keys
there was little doubt as to which one was to his house. The bitting happened to be fairly easy to remember.
So when he called me up one day wondering if I could make a couple copies of his house keys I said sure.
Next time we met I handed him two keys to his home... you can imagine the questions that followed. lol

It was a bit of a risk pre-cutting the keys. But judging by the wear I had seen on his key, I assumed the lock and
pins were just as old and just as worn. I compensated by leaving the first few cuts just a 'touch' high. It worked
out fine and they ended up working smoothly. It was worth the risk just to see the look on his face. lol

On a unrelated note - I rekey all the locks in my house once a year. Not because I'm that paranoid, but because
I usually service them every year. If I've tore them down that far in order to clean & lube, it's not that much more
effort to throw in some different pins. Also, I'm not the only one with a key. There's a few people I give keys to so
they have access to my home. The more keys I have out in the world - the less 'key control' I have. I know where
MY key is... but who's to say that one of those OTHER keys haven't been compromised?

Lastly, Schlage usually prints the the bitting on the bow of the key! Yes, that's a direct code. Those ARE the cuts.
*shakes his head*, lol. No need to even decode it by sight. It's right there! If you're really concerned by this you
can always bring a couple of the cuts down a step or two so it no longer matches what's stamped on the bow.

Re: Doens't seem like a good idea to me ...

PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2017 11:52 pm
by madsamurai
Here's how I see it... It's mind-blowing to me how naive and reckless people are with their security on the internet. So, just as an exercise and a good example about posting keys on the internet, I looked up my friend's FB profile, who I mentioned before and who still hasn't taken down the picture of her keys. As I mentioned, her picture included the actual bitting code printed on one of them, so no decoding necessary to figure it out, and they're Kwikset so easy enough to identify the blank. She never posted her actual address anywhere or pictures of the outside of her house so that's kinda good -- but there are lots of pics taken in the driveway showing surrounding houses in the background, and she did a silly "check in" at her bathtub post that showed it pinned on a map, so now it's easy to find her house, and google street view confirms her neighbors' houses match. Lots of pics of her new furniture, her new TV, and her two young daughters, and she constantly checks in at events and restaurants, and publicizes when and where she's going on vacations. There's plenty more info to work with if more details are wanted. She has about 700 'friends' linked to her profile, so I'm pretty sure there are plenty she doesn't actually know, and all of her posts are public so all of their friends see her posts too (and their friends, etc).

I guess the way I see it is criminals are just people who do illegal things, and I can only assume some of them are at least as smart as me. It seriously took about 15 minutes to figure it all out. If somebody wants her stuff (or god forbid her daughters), she's pretty much hozed, and she ultimately handed it out for free. Sure, the keys pic is really just a convenience in the big picture, but that bit means somebody strange can just walk up and let themselves in while she's away and if a neighbor intercepts, well, they have a key and are just watering the plants or taking care of the cat while she's away as a favor. He could come back every day for a week or more and take a little each time if he wanted.

I think posting pics of keys is a symptom of this much bigger problem... people just don't see how they're throwing away their own security, and don't take it seriously because of this fallacy that all criminals are stupid.

Re: Doens't seem like a good idea to me ...

PostPosted: Tue May 23, 2017 1:06 am
by femurat
Oldfast wrote:Funny story from a few years back; There's a good friend of mine who I'd see on a weekly bases at a meeting
I attend. Every week he'd sit down next to me and flop his keys up on the table. Out of the small mess of keys
there was little doubt as to which one was to his house. The bitting happened to be fairly easy to remember.
So when he called me up one day wondering if I could make a couple copies of his house keys I said sure.
Next time we met I handed him two keys to his home... you can imagine the questions that followed. lol

It was a bit of a risk pre-cutting the keys. But judging by the wear I had seen on his key, I assumed the lock and
pins were just as old and just as worn. I compensated by leaving the first few cuts just a 'touch' high. It worked
out fine and they ended up working smoothly. It was worth the risk just to see the look on his face. lol


That was a nice one! I wish I saw his face :mrgreen:

Oldfast wrote:Lastly, Schlage usually prints the the bitting on the bow of the key! Yes, that's a direct code. Those ARE the cuts.
*shakes his head*, lol. No need to even decode it by sight. It's right there! If you're really concerned by this you
can always bring a couple of the cuts down a step or two so it no longer matches what's stamped on the bow.


That's pretty easy to cover with a silicon cap on the house key. You know, a colored one that covers the bow and helps you find the key.

madsamurai wrote:I think posting pics of keys is a symptom of this much bigger problem... people just don't see how they're throwing away their own security, and don't take it seriously because of this fallacy that all criminals are stupid.


I couldn't agree more. I try not to reveal info about me online, and encourage my friends to be cautious too. A bit of privacy never hurts.

Cheers :)

Re: Doens't seem like a good idea to me ...

PostPosted: Tue May 23, 2017 7:10 pm
by jeffmoss26
bidding is what you do on ebay. bitting is the cuts on a key. carry on!

Re: Doens't seem like a good idea to me ...

PostPosted: Tue May 23, 2017 9:20 pm
by Pick-Fu
Sorry about that guys... Im on major pain meds most of the time so my mind gets a bit fuzzy and I lose the ability to figure out stupid things like that.. At least I caught it, I think

Re: Doens't seem like a good idea to me ...

PostPosted: Wed May 24, 2017 6:29 am
by MartinHewitt
I am sure we are not confused with ebay in this context. As long as we understand you all is fine.