Disc detainer pick

[the lockpickkid]

Hey guys, if I wanted to be able to pick the occasional disk detainer lock like the new bike locks have, what tool should I use and where do I get a fairly cheap but reliable model, it probably would't be used alot but it would be nice to have on hand.

[awol70]

these are 15 bux or so.. they are only good for the rectangular keyway,,(solex knockoff) ist disc zero cut types.
anything tensioning from any other disc than the first wont work,nor will any other keyway,ie:Blackspur Abloy (all types),Abus plus,S&G,EVA etc.
fun stuff,though..

[Solomon]

I have a question about disc detainers aswell... ordered a bunch of locks off ebay recently and one arrived the other day which was, to my surprise, a disc mechanism. I didn't realise this when I bought it, as the pic wasn't clear enough to see the keys. Of course, not long before this particular lock arrived, I decided against buying a disc detainer pick along with the other stuff I treated myself to... talk about irony.

I'm not overly familiar with how they work, but I have an idea of how to pick them and plan to make some kind of makeshift thinger to do me until I get around to ordering one of the dedicated picks. In the meantime... can someone clear a few things up for me? The keyway is rectangular and I can count a number of discs by looking in there... but there are way more discs than cuts in the key, and the discs run down the entire length of the keyway. The bitting in the key is near the tip, so I'm assuming most of the discs don't need to be aligned to any particular angle. So, why all the discs?

Here are a couple of pics so you can see what I'm seeing:





Once I understand that stuff, the next thing is tensioning the lock and knowing how far to rotate each disc. I had a fiddle about with it by doing different things with the key and I'm guessing that if I apply tension to the first disc and slowly rotate the others with something, they'll each stop at a certain point and then I can just repeat that for the others - eventually opening the lock. Am I on the right track here? I've seen the disc picks before and by the looks of it they tension the first disc, so that's where my idea is coming from. If I'm not on the right track, what sort of things should I be feeling for? Is there such a thing as an overset disc? So many questions running through my head right now.

Thanks in advance, everyone!

[Solomon]

Hey guys, I put the whole disc detainer thing aside for a while but the missus came back today with a new lock for me to play with - and it's another disc detainer, so my interest is rekindled.

I researched the mechanism properly a while ago so I know how everything works and I'm pretty sure I know what to be feeling for. The way everything looks, one of the discs should be binding on the sidebar and I'll feel a bit of movement as it goes into the gate, then the next disc will bind and so on. Essentially it's the same as picking any other lock... just with different tools. This should be fun!

I'm gonna see if I can come up with some sort of tensioner and try to rotate the discs with a lifter pick for now. Disc detainer pick is on my christmas list, but I wanna get these things open before then.

[KokomoLock]

I am also interested in finding a pick for these locks. Awol, you say 15 bucks or so but from where, is there a distributor in the U.S. or Canada where I could purchase a couple? I have been seeing more and more of these at the local Walmart and it is all they have now at Autozone for the hitch type locks so it wont be long before they start rolling into the shop???? Any help would be greatly appreciated, thanks Kid for bringing it up, hopefully they are a lot better than the old Fulton hitch lock!!!!!!!

[bezza1]

you can buy them from www.uklockpickers.co.uk hope this helps

[Solomon]

Well, this has been a failure so far. Here's what I came up with...



Basic jiggler for zeroing the discs, lifter pick for rotating them, and a wiper insert contraption for tension.

This is the tensioner in place:


It's fiddly as hell and keeps popping out. Absolute nightmare to feel what's going on in there... it's gonna take me till christmas to get this thing open. Literally.

[HallisChalmers]

Take a look a these disc detainer picks for a better idea of how you need to make your tool.


http://www.uklockpickers.co.uk/oscommerce/catalog/index.php?cPath=15&sort=2a&page=3&osCsid=v95iksd01bfgbnh0v9lrduc3i7

[Solomon]

Take a look a these disc detainer picks for a better idea of how you need to make your tool.


http://www.uklockpickers.co.uk/oscommerce/catalog/index.php?cPath=15&sort=2a&page=3&osCsid=v95iksd01bfgbnh0v9lrduc3i7

I tried making something like the proper tool before, believe me. Most of it looks simple enough, but to tension the first disc I'd need something small and square/rectangular with a hole in the middle for the rod to pass through and I couldn't find anything suitable. Also, making the tool so the tensioning bit sits right on the first disc would be a PITA aswell.

I've seen homebrew ones before but I have no idea what the hell people are using to make them. If anyone has a list of actual supplies, go for it. Even though I'm buying one it'd be a fun little project.

[the lockpickkid]

I am also interested in finding a pick for these locks. Awol, you say 15 bucks or so but from where, is there a distributor in the U.S. or Canada where I could purchase a couple? I have been seeing more and more of these at the local Walmart and it is all they have now at Autozone for the hitch type locks so it wont be long before they start rolling into the shop???? Any help would be greatly appreciated, thanks Kid for bringing it up, hopefully they are a lot better than the old Fulton hitch lock!!!!!!!

Thats's what I was thinking, sooner or later somebody is going to want one of these picked, I want to be able to take on one of these. A person needs to try to keep up with the technology!!

[Solomon]

Thats's what I was thinking, sooner or later somebody is going to want one of these picked, I want to be able to take on one of these. A person needs to try to keep up with the technology!!

Most locksmiths don't bother with them, they just DE them since they don't have the machines to cut the keys so the lock is useless once it's off anyway. Disc detainer padlocks haven been increasing in popularity over here, most of them cost just as much as regular padlocks - often less. The one my gf picked up today was a 40mm and only cost £1!

It'd be good to pick the cheapy ones, they only have a few cuts on the key and the tolerances are probably very forgiving, so if you have one of those little tools they'll not put up much of a fight. That way you look professional, don't break a sweat, and you get a new lock for your collection. Score!

There's no point buying specialised equipment for decoding and cutting a key for a lock that cost under £15 though... not nearly enough demand for it yet and the cost to the customer would be ridiculous, they may as well bust it off and buy a new one.

The ABUS Granit series is a different story though, I've seen some of those in shops and they're around the £100 mark. Tough little blighters aswell. Still, the amount of times you'd get a callout to open and make a key for those just wouldn't justify the cost of the equipment.

Why am I rambling about this? I should really be making breakfast.

[loki]

If anyone is still interested in tools for inexpensive disk detainers -these tools are not intended to work on the real Abloy product-they can be
ordered from overseas- a set, tool for top tensioning and one for bottom tensioning locks, can be had for about $US 35.

With the mods o.k. I'll post the vendor info.

[uklockpicker]

These disc detainer tools will pick ..Blackspur,blue-spot,am-tech,monteray,legion tools (thanks Ray) and others....The more popular these locks become the more you will find them about.

I really like your home made tension tool solomon, i havent seen anyone try making any home made's for the disc detainer locks. nice work

[uklockpicker]

Take a look here at my sponcers 1st detainer lock, www.youtube.com/user/RosinDubh37713#p/u/4/-qAsV22nMG4

Or even view Awols vids on legion tool !.....
Loads of vids out there study and watch , these tools work !

[Solomon]

These disc detainer tools will pick ..Blackspur,blue-spot,am-tech,monteray,legion tools (thanks Ray) and others....The more popular these locks become the more you will find them about.

I really like your home made tension tool solomon, i havent seen anyone try making any home made's for the disc detainer locks. nice work

I'll add silverline to that list, I've seen disc detainer shutter locks made by them.

The tensioner I made looks like ass and it's terrible to use... if I made a more precise version and tapered the ends a little to grip the disc it'd be better. Plenty of space between the discs in the cheap ones so I could try it.

Or... I could just buy one. Yep. I think I'll just do that.