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LocksportSouth's Stash

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LocksportSouth

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Joined: Thu Dec 03, 2015 12:51 am

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Post Thu Dec 10, 2015 4:12 pm

Re: LocksportSouth's Stash

HT4 wrote:Nice lock porn!


Thanks! :mrgreen:

More lock porn. :cool:

This stuff turned up yesterday but I was too busy to photograph it and get it uploaded.

First up, Abloy 320!
Since I started the Abloy collection, I figured it was only fair to pick up the cheapie tiny ones to complement their older brothers:

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The 320 is non-rekeyable and uses the older Abloy "High profile" (I think that's the term!) classic keyway. Aside from that, it looks like like another Abloy!

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Classic keyway:

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So tiny!

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Adorable shackle:

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Tiiiiiny!

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I got this one from an online shop, so it came with the original packaging:

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And then there's the 321 - A small step up from the 320, but an important one - it actually houses a full Sentry keyway, and I believe you can get one in Protec as well, if you want to be utterly ridiculous :D.
The notches on the cylinder plug indicate that it should be re-keyable, but I don't think it is.

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Tiny!

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You can see the keyway plug notches in this photo:

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I forgot to take a photo of the side, but it has a hole much higher up (I assume a drainage hole) and then the hole lower down, which would normally be the "maintenance access", has a rivet type thing in it. I don't think it's unscrewable.

Going back to the bottom, lit up you can see all the disks inside:

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Key in:

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Unlocked:

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Two down - Two to go!
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LocksportSouth

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Post Thu Dec 10, 2015 4:14 pm

Re: LocksportSouth's Stash

Part 2

So, with those cute Abloys out of the way, let's move on to some BEEFY locks! :mrgreen:

First up - a CISA 285 / 75!

Cisas are a big part of why I first got into locks, so I'm proud to finally make these part of my collection

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Love the little textured hub at the end of the shutter bolt:

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Protecting the keyway is both a THICK hardened front plate, and a pretty thick cylinder-linked free-spinning anti drill plate. Look at that keyway profile, too :shock:. Also "Made in Italy"

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The key, with so many grooves it looks like a McCoys potato chip :D

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Key in lock:

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Like the open shackle from yesterday, the keys have a small range of movement:

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Shackle slides directly back, catching at the two points where there are depressions in the shackle:

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Unlocked:

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I spent a while trying to work out how to strip this, without much success. It's clear from the little hole at the top of the lock that that's where you insert the hex key, but the shackle is in the way.
Luckily I found a video that explains the process. First, see the little round notch at the bottom of the shackle hole:

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Grab a shim or a thin pick etc and shove it in there. Coming directly up from the keyway is a spring and then a pin which locks into the shackle grooves and prevents it from being removed. Our goal is to depress that pin so that the shackle can slide out freely:

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The shackle will slide out all the way. Please do this SLOWLY! If you pull out the shackle too fast, the pin (under spring tension) will fly out of the lock. I didn't actually do this as I watched a video of another guy stripping the lock down and was able to do it more carefully. Note that at the end of the shackle, the edge of the recess on the side of the rest of the bolt is rounded, whereas on the other end (against the tip of the shackle) it's a sharp, straight cut? That's to prevent the shackle slipping out in normal use:

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You can see the pin inside the shackle hole.

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You can now see the hex screw that needs removing via that hole in the top of the lock:

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You should also remove the pin and spring with a pair of tweezers:

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Sadly, that's where my lock-stripping adventure ends. The video that I used for reference is This video, which I believe to be one of the only CISA stripping videos on YouTube (I certainly haven't found any others, just picking videos). Around the 2:42 mark he shows how you can use a screwdriver (he says screwdriver but seems to be using some kind of modified pick) to pull the protection plate out. Unfortunately despite over and hour of fiddling, key in, key out, different tools, multiple tools, screw in, screw out, basically trying everything - I couldn't remove it. In another Youtube video someone who picks the lock says that you'd have to drill out that round plug thing in the bottom of the lock to disassemble it - I don't know if that's true, and does seem a bit strange considering how they've made all the steps up until this point fairly easy (hex grub screw, etc), however I have not been able to remove the front plate on any of my CISA shutter locks. Maybe I just have the wrong tools, or the wrong technique.

Final shot, unlocked:

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We now move on to the CISA 285 / 85, which is extremely similar to the /75, just a little larger:

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Here's that round bottom plug thingy that I was talking about drilling out in the last lock:

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Same textured bolt-puller:

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Same tough-looking keyway:

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Key:

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In my hand - looking huge!

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Unlocking:

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Unlocked, shackle open. Note that when inserting the shim to remove the shackle, the shackle must be in THIS position! (I.e. the pin fully pushed back by the thick middle barrel of the shackle). If you allow the pin to slot down into either of the end shackle notches you'll have a much harder time pushing it all the way back in:

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Unlocked and fully open:

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To strip, same procedure as last time: pull shackle out half way, insert a shim at the bottom:

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Pull out the bolt:

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Remove the spring and pin:

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Unscrew the grub screw with a hex key (I think these are 2.5mm or 3mm):

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Bits:

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You can then pry it open. As with the /75, I spent ages trying to get this plate off with no success.
Protip: When re-assembling, put the grub screw back in first and then the spring and pin. To fit the bolt back in, push the pin down with the end of a tension wrench to hold it in place, then slide the shackle in. the end of the shackle will hold the pin in place as it goes through, and once it passes the pin will jump into place fine:

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Re-assembled:

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MrPicky

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Post Fri Dec 11, 2015 12:36 pm

Re: LocksportSouth's Stash

Wow, what a fantastic collection! I am extremely envious. :drool:

Wonderful photographs, too. Thanks for sharing!
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LocksportSouth

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Post Fri Dec 11, 2015 2:01 pm

Re: LocksportSouth's Stash

Thank you, much appreciated! I've always loved locks but never really invested the time or money into looking at all the options and actually investing in new locks. Now I've started, I've gone a bit crazy, haha! My new lock posts will be tapering off soon though, except for the stuff I have coming I really shouldn't spend any more right now ^_^;;

I was wondering when I started photographing whether to just do quick overviews but I figured that doing breakdowns of all the locks would be more fun, a technical challenge for me and might help other people who are struggling to figure stuff out. Can you believe there's only -one- video that I know of showing CISA breakdowns?

Photography wise, I'm currently trying to figure out the best way to shoot these. Currently I have no spare space and I'm just laying them out on a bedsheet on my bed, haha! Using natural light or 1-2 Interfit Stellar 750 lights (depending on how bothered I can be to get the full setup done), on my little point and shoot camera (Canon PowerShot G7X). I do have a better setup but never seem to have space or time to get it all assembled - might be easier in the new year once I get some stuff sorted but we'll see how it goes. Anyway, I'm rambling on now (don't get me started on photography, I'll never shut up lol).
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LocksportSouth

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Post Mon Dec 14, 2015 2:08 am

Re: LocksportSouth's Stash

Right, I have three new updates today.. Think I'm going to go in order of least (comparatively!) to most awesome, so stick around to the end :mrgreen:


Update Numero Uno

You've seen both of my CISA Closed Shackle locks - the /75 and the /85. Here's the 66 to complete the set!

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Just for completeness, I DID also try stripping this one down and hit the same brickwall removing the outer cylinder plate. I didn't bother to photograph the takedown process up until that point because it's identical to the other two and I don't want to bore you with redundant photos :D.

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Looks small in my hand compared with the other two:

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Same keyway:

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Pretty thin shackle!

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Three bonus pics of the three (four) Cisas all together :D

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And that brings part one to a close :).

Update Numero Duo

Whilst I couldn't quite attribute it to the "lock that got me into locks" (that honour goes jointly to the Cisa shutterlock and the Assa Ruko), I spent a lot of my childhood in lockshops and hardware shops marvelling at locks. Chubbs were very big in the UK at that time, and almost every lockshop had a range of heavy, beefy Chubb padlocks in stock that I'd spend ages drooling over. So it was really a no-brainer for me to pick up a nice Chubb or two.

The only problem is, since being taken over by Assa, the design of the Chubb locks has changed - the Cruiser and Battleship now have those words stamped into them, rather than the old-style "Chubb", as well of course as the new Assa packaging. That's fine and all, and it's great to have a shiny new lock, but I was really after is a bit of nostalgia. Luckily, eBay came up trumps for me this time:

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:
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Yeah, the paint is a little scratched up but other than that it's in perfect condition. The keys operate smoothly and the finish is lovely apart from a few nicks. The fact that it comes with the original box and keys seals the deal for me. Just a shame I haven't been able to find an "original" Battleship!

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Lever locks. They don't make 'em like that any more!:

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Keyway weather guard:

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Paint scrapes:

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Seems to be made of laminate plates, riveted together. The Battleship doesn't have those so god knows how they do that one, I sadly haven't had occasion to inspect it

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The back:

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Unlocked:

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I forgot to photograph it, but you can lock these open, it's fun to watch the locking pole (more of a locking sheet) moving across as you turn the key:

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And that brings up to the end of part two!
I have to say I'm very happy to own a nice Chubb lock finally. This has to be one of my favourites in my collection so far... Well... Maybe except for the next one... :wink:


And finally.... Update Numero Tres
*drumroll* :D

Mysterious brown box... (Yes yes, some of you will know exactly what this is from the box, shush :P)

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What could it be, I wonder? :D

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Oh yeah, baby 8)

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So, this is my new "first born" lock. And, well, it weighs as much as a new born baby. Probably more. Sheesh. I'm surprised it didn't pull the staple off the wall through sheer weight alone :mrgreen:

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Original everything - lock, keys, instructions, chain, box.
I'm so chuffed to get this through.. It got sent through eBay using their "Global Shipping Programme", which is terrible. I figure I'm lucky to have it this "soon", to be honest. Not that it's going to get damaged in transit :mrgreen:
I hear they only made a very limited run of these and that they were used for securing nuclear ordinance. I don't know if this one ever saw use for that purpose (or another purpose) or whether it just sat in a box for years but it's kinda cool to think that maybe this very lock was once used to keep nukes safe 8)

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Love how clean and clear that instruction sheet is after decades in storage (I guess there's a change that the instructions aren't the original? Hard to know one way or another though).

Original keys. It's a Medeco core and comes with two operator keys (for locking and unlocking the lock), and one control key (for removing the core):

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Close-up of the control key ("Medeco" side):

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Same key, "US MILITARY PROPERTY DO NOT DUP" side:

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Note the little cut-out notch in the back of the key shaft? That's the only difference between the Control and Operator keys.

Close-up of the regular key:

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And the back:

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Medeco's famed angular bitting:

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Front side. VERY clean, VERY good condition. So maybe it wasn't used, or wasn't used for long:

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And the back (or.. Front? The shackle side, anyway):

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The top. I love these GIANT messy welded-in disks. Did they literally make this padlock by taking a massive chunk of steel, boring holes in it, dumping the guts of a padlock inside and just whacking a giant disk over the hole and welding it shut? That's.... Utilitarian :mrgreen:

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Another one, on the side. I wonder if that could be a weakness for the lock? Dremel cut around the weld, pop the disk out and pull the guts out. Not sure how strong the weld joint is though, maybe it's like that wood glue thing... "The joint is stronger than the pieces that it holds" or whatever that advert was...

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The bottom. Man, look at that plug! Huge.

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Close-up. There are more anti-drill disks in there as well as the natural shielding provided by the plug. The two small holes at the top are to attach a chain, and staple to keep the lock attached to something. Though IMO looking at the chain and staple provided, I reckon if you picked up the lock, held it at the highest you could above the height of the staple (max chain length) and dropped it, it'd probably rip the staple right off the wall:

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Operator key inserted. Note that it goes right into the body; there's no loose key-bits showing below the bow:

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Rotating the key actually pulls the shackle back as you turn it. Confused me a bit at first but it actually makes a lot of sense when you think about how this lock would have to be mounted. Also the cylinder, at least in mine, "catches" in some strange ways. It's not perfectly smooth but I think that's to do with things not perfectly lining up or to do with the dual-function locking system rather than any sloppy tolerances in manufacture or anything like that.

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Shackle open:

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Control key inserted and removing the plug / cylinder. Look how crazy thick the bottom of that plug is! You can see now how the chain attaches too - pop the end link of the chain into the lil notch provided and then slide the plug back into the lock. The bit in the middle of the cutout holds it in place.

The control key is a little fiddly to use - in mine, I find that you need to put it in, turn it slightly to the locked position and then turn it back all the way (slightly further than the regular operating key will go), and then turn the key all the way back to the "locked" position before sliding the plug out. To re-insert it, manually slide the shackle to the locked position (it's loose when the cylinder isn't inserted) and pop the plug in, then turn the key VERY SLIGHTLY towards "unlock), no more than 5-10 degrees or so although you'll need to jiggle the key around a bit and it'll pop right now. The key will NOT come out if pushed all the way to the lock position. Took me a while to work that out :D

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Plug removed, and the locking pawl came off (basically the actuator for the shackle):

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Inside the lock. The Pawl interacts with the shackle and that sticky-up bit of metal at the end of the plug hole:

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The pawl itself. The big bit sits behind the end of the shackle and stops it being forced back. The little bit sits in a gap in the shackle and what actually pulls it back when unlocking:

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Bottom of the pawl. The wide rectangular hole slots into the end of the cylinder itself and is actuated by the cylinder turning. The little semi-circular hole in the side is where a ball bearing sits, we'll get to that later:

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This shot is just to marvel at how thick the outside-edge of that plug is. Day-um. (Oh and also, you can see the little hole on the lefthand top side, near the inside end of the plug. A nub will stick out of here when the plug is inserted and is that stops it from falling out:

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The back end of the plug/cylinder, with that BB we mentioned. The BB slots back into that small hole that it "lives in", and in the process of doing so pushes on two ends of two metal rods that poke out of the side and hold the plug in place. When the right key is inserted, the BB is able to pop out into the cylinder area (as here), allowing the rods to retract and the plug to come out:

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Rods will pop out slightly when not held out with BB, but are easy to push back in:

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Rod depressed. Also another view of that chain holding notch:

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Actuator fitted to the bottom of the plug:

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Took me ages to figure out how to remove the cylinder. The BB holds it in place, but can be forced back into it's "hole" by pushing on the front of the cylinder. The way I did it was to take the key out, turn it around 180 degrees (so the key is backward) and push on the cylinder with the key until you manage to force the cylinder past the BB and out of the back, like so:

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Warning! The BB will go flying! Don't lose it :mrgreen:

Cylinder removed (BB back in place - put the plug on it's back like this so that the BB stays there):

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The cylinder:

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The view down inside the plug, with the cylinder removed. At the front are a couple of hardened anti-drill plates. You CAN remove these, along with all those other parts I mentioned earlier, but I didn't for fear or buggering something up:

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All the bits I dared to remove :D (the screws in the packaging are to screw the chain staple into the wall):

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There's a bit of rust and some scrapes near the front. Makes me think it's been used once or twice at least...

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Reassembled and unlocked with regular operator key:

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BONUS ROUND

A couple of things I've been meaning to show for a while :wink:

First off - now that this beasty has arrived, here's a couple of shots of my best padlocks (That's, uhm, my favourite locks, not BEST branded ^_^;;) to date. They've all been re-tagged with the colour-coded key tag, lobster clip and new ring and are ready for storage:

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I like the little line of progressively more beastly Abloys :D
(Oh, and yes, I realise that the Cisa /66 keys are under the /75 lock and vice versa. I didn't realise until it was all packed up and I got to editing the photos and don't feel like setting it all up again. Looks like all the others are correct; just my luck that the most visible lock was the wrong one :D)

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Also, I randomly picked up this tool organiser from a local big chain DIY place the other day. I was going to use it for picks, pins and random bits but just so happens that it's PERFECT for storing locks, and keys:

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Sadly it doesn't lock. Partly for (modest) security and partly cos I feel that a box full of locks should be locked :D.
Keys organised: Abloy (blue), Cisa (green), Ingersoll (White), Chubb (Red), Ruko (Black - I've left a couple of free slots for more of these, haha) and Military (Yellow). Bottom row is a selection of keyrings (split rings), keytags and lobster clasps:

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Bottom drawer, from left to right, top to bottom:
Drawer one: Ingersoll open shackle & Chubb Cruiser
Drawer two: Abloy 362, Abloy 350 and Ruko 2 (D12, 2641)
Drawer three: Avocet ABS Euro Cylinder, Cisa Astal S Euro Cylinder
Drawer four: Cisa 285/85, Cisa 285/75, Abloy Protec2 Euro Cylinder
Drawer five: Hi-Shear, Abloy 342
Drawer six: Cisa 285/66, Abloy 330, Abloy 321, Abloy 320

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Box fully open with all the stuff in. Love that it contains everything perfectly; I'll def. be getting more of these. Oh, and don't fear for the "discarded" original boxes - currently they're in an old cardboard packaging box awaiting a nice roomy "Really Useful Box" - plastic Tuff-Crate style thing to keep them all safe in.

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And -THAT-, finally, is it for me today. Been a helluvu day :mrgreen:


P.s. If you want to get hold of one of those oh-so-sexy Hi-Shears, fear not! This was one of two that I was watching - both are very similar but I went for this one because it looked in slightly better condition, was slightly cheaper and came with the chain rather than the original hasp & staple (personal preference. You can find the other one (eBay auction) HERE. Snap it up quickly before I decide that the only thing better than having one Hi-Shear to display is having TWO Hi-Shears to display, and end up with my bank manager / and or girlfriend banging at my front door baying for my blood :mrgreen:
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MrPicky

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Post Mon Dec 14, 2015 11:53 am

Re: LocksportSouth's Stash

Puts my cardboard box of old cylinders to shame, lol. I need to sort out some proper storage.

Again, lovely pics!
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LocksportSouth

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Post Mon Dec 14, 2015 1:11 pm

Re: LocksportSouth's Stash

Thank you :D

That box up there ^^^ You can get from B&Q, only £20 :)
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LocksportSouth

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Post Tue Dec 15, 2015 10:32 pm

Re: LocksportSouth's Stash

Quick new update:

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Closed shackle Ingersoll :)

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I actually ordered this with the super-closed shackle one, but they accidentally sent the open shackle one instead, so I'm currently going through return with that. Also, apparently they've stopped making the 12mm shackle version of this one which is a shame (although it's still up on the official Ingersoll site).

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Keys. Never get tired of that key profile:

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Nice meaty shoulders :D

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Gotta love that weather protection plate thingy:

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<3

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Seems they all use that blasted roll pin. Which means I'll prob never strip any of these as I don't know if I'd ever get the pin back in again:

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Unlocked:

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Nice shackle, little thinner than my open shackle version:

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One of two bottom plate holdy-in screws (technical term :D):

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LocksportSouth

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Post Wed Dec 16, 2015 4:12 am

Re: LocksportSouth's Stash

Ok, so this is a fun lock.

You might have heard about the Forever Lock - LockMan28 did a review back in early 2014 and BosnianBill did a video also in late 2014. They have been shown to be at least a little susceptible to impressioning and bumping but I still personally think that they are fascinating, interesting locks.

If you've been on their official site recently, you'll know that they are no longer only a rare prototype but are publicly available, not just in D-lock format but also as padlocks, steering wheel locks, motorcycle disk locks and door deadbolts, among others.

I ordered one via the official site a few weeks back but it only arrived Yesterday - here's my take!

For reference, I have ordered the padlock version, in black colour. The locking bar part of the lock is the same size and thickness as the full size versions (in fact, I believe that all versions of the ForeverLock use the same size locking bar, as that's the space required to fit the keyway and all the clever shielding), however it is fitted with a smaller padlock shackle, still in D lock format, rather than the full size bicycle D-lock design.

It comes in very plain, utilitarian, clamshell packaging. There is no retail box as far as I know and that's probably fine - let's be honest, with the complexity of operating this product and the east of destructive entry, it's probably more focused on being an interesting concept product anyway.

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With the packaging removed, you can see all of the components:
* The padlock / D-Lock itself
* Large rubber protector for the front of the locking bar (I like to call it the lock condom :D)
* Small rubber ring, presumably for protecting the back of the lock (I assume these are also to protect the thing it's being locked onto (e.g. the bicycle itself) FROM the lock as well)
* Two keys contained within pill-pop snap-opening containers, each attached to a lobster clasp
* One "loose" key, packaged in a small plastic box

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Closeup of the lock condom:

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The two key pots and the loose key:

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To access the key, simply snap back the lid on one of the pots:

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This weird L notch is actually the bow of the key. There's a reason for the odd shape, and you'll see what that is soon:

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Key removed from pot:

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Key bitting. It is a dimple lock locking system, and appears to use 7 pins (4 on the top, which you can see here, and 3 on the right hand side as you look from the tip of the key back to the bow). There look to be at least 4 bitting positions; beyond that I cannot say.

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The lock. The padlock shackle is seriously swamped by the mammoth size of the locking bar:

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ForeverLock logo:

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Where the magic happens:

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So. What's clever about this lock? What makes it so special? Well, if you haven't heard about it yet, the trick to the ForeverLock is that you can't access the keyway. Not at all. Nada. If you can't access it, you can't pick it - at least that's the theory. I'm sure I've seen some Forever Lock packaging somewhere that bore the logo "You can't pick what you can't see", or something similar. However mine came with no such packaging or claims.

The way this lock works, in short, is that you load the key into a chamber, and then insert the key into the keyway in a way that makes it impossible for you to actually see or access the keyway itself. To explain this a little better, let's use photos.

Step one in opening the lock is to pull back the bottom-front section of the lock, like so:

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You can just pull it back, no hidden switches or anything like that.
You then need to rotate the main black ring on the lock clockwise (facing from the "front" of the lock looking backwards towards the shackle.
Rotating this around will bring an empty round hole for the key to fit into:

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"But wait!" you might say, "Isn't that the keyway? Can't we pick it now?"
Nope! It's an empty cylinder. If you look into it, all you'll see it smooth metal at the back:

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This is, however, where you insert the key. The front (nearest the key blade) section of the bow is mostly round, but is flat on one edge to force the key to be insertable only one way. Note the flat bottom edge once the key is inserted:

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You might also have noticed the open slot in the top of the bottom pulled-out section perfectly placed and sized for the back part of the bow of the key. To begin the process of opening the lock, rotate that black ring back the way it came:

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The key will slide seamlessly through that slot and continue back until the full rotation is complete. The key now sits underneath the lock, totally inaccessible, in the compartment into which it is inserted, in the drawer at the bottom of the lock:

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The key is not in the keyway currently (as you can imagine). First, you need to push that bottom section back in. This will push the key into the keyway, hidden at the bottom of the lock:

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To turn the key, you'll need to use the final part of the mechanism - the little cutout slice at the very end of the bottom tray. Turning this will rotate a bar inside the lock which will catch on that funky L shaped key bow, causing it to turn within the keyway, unlocking the lock:

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Here's the locking pole in the locked position:

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Semi-open:

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Open:

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The shackle is decent but I doubt it'd stand up against bolt croppers. The locking pole is, however, un-shimmable and the lock should stand up to surreptitious entry to all but the most determined.

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And that it! Hope you enjoyed :).
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LocksportSouth

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Post Tue Dec 22, 2015 4:01 am

Re: LocksportSouth's Stash

Thanks to some excellent advice that I recently received, I've been able to extract the roll pin that was holding the shackle in place in my open and closed shackle Ingersolls and I'm now able to share the dismantling process with you :).

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This is the pin in question. When embedded within the lock body, it looks a little like a small hex grub screw, however putting a hex key into the cutout hole will quickly show you that this isn't the case. For some reason Ingersoll decided that rather than fitting a fairly standard screw to hold the shackle in place, they would use a "roll pin", which appears to be a kinda rolled up flat piece of metal, like a newspaper. I was a little concerned that it would unravel if I decided to try and punch it out, but thankfully this proved not to be the case.

I suspect part of their reasoning is due to the fact that you can't (AFAIK) replace the Ingersoll cylinder with anything other than another Ingersoll cylinder, due to their unique size and shape. I guess this would make re-"pinning" (the Ingersoll locks actually technically use levers) or replacing the cylinder less likely, so they figure most people will never need to get in here. Still, it's a shame that they went this route and I ended up marring the finish around the roll pin hole in this lock attempting to figure out how to remove it.

Here's the lock, unlocked as normal, with the screw from inside the shackle hole on the open shackle side removed. The cylinder protecting plate is held in by two screws, one in each side of the shackle hole, and both must be removed in order to remove the plate and access the cylinder:

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To remove the roll pin, I first started using the pointy end of a pair of long tweezer things that are part of a PC repair kit that I have, however I found that these get too wide too quickly to push out the pin. I eventually found the solution though - a just-the-right-size-for-the-hole hex key and whacked it through with the end of a pair of pliers :D

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Then just use said pliers to pull the roll pin out. Here's the devil:

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With the roll pin removed, the shackle falls away easily:

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With the shackle removed, you can now get into the other shackle hole and remove the second screw. You need to keep the key inserted and the lock unlocked, otherwise the shackle BBs will be forced out and cover most of the shackle hole, preventing a screwdriver from fitting in. However you'll need to remove the key to take the bottom plate out.

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With both screws and the key removed, the key protecting bottom plate will fall away:

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It's pretty thick, and seems to be made of two laminated sheets:

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The cylinder is the giant ass round bit in the middle. See what I mean about these not being standard cylinders? :D.
The holes to either side are where the screws fit to the bottom plate:

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To remove the cylinder, insert the key and turn the lock about a 1/4 turn until the sidebar fits into it's rounded groove. I think you can take it out at any angle but I found this was the easiest way.

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Down inside the empty cylinder hole - note the shackle BBs poking their noses out on the left and right. If they keep rolling out and won't stay in place when you're trying to reinsert, rub them with some silicone paste, vasaline or your favourite lock lube to keep them from moving too much.

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The plug a bit closer. Note the actuator on the end (left hand side) which allows the BBs to fall into the cutout areas and unlock the lock. It's fixed, as far as I can tell.

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Sidebar mechanism and springs, held down:

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I dunno WHAT is going on with this lock. Apparently these are levers, blowed if I can figure out how this thing works. Hella cool though.

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Exposed levers side:

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Actuator at the end of the cylinder with the original lube still in place:

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More of the levers / sidebar area:

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When re-assembling, note that the cutouts for the bottom plate and the screw holes etc are identical both ways around. Thus you can install it like this:

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... Or like this. Choose your preference:

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Once you've reinserted the screws and shackle (long side of the shackle on the roll pin hole side), you can fit the roll pin back. I recommend shoving it in with pliers, using a small hammer or end of the pliers to push it back most of the way and then tapping it back in with the end of a hex key and the hammer/pliers.

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As you can see in this next pic, I mistakenly tried to use these computer repair kit pliers, which ended up damaging the area around the roll pin as it wedged in too far. Don't do this! Find something that doesn't get thicker than the hole width. Also, apparently the hole is kinda conical, in that it's thinner (narrower) on one end than the other. Look carefully at/into the hole as the roll pin will not install the wrong way round and you'll end up damaging the pin, the tool, the lock or all three!

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Sad scratched up hole :(. I filed off the burrs with a metal nail file so at least it's not scratchy any more.

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That's it for the Open shackle! Now let's move on to the closed shackle version. Pretty much identical!

Starting off the same way. Locate that roll pin...

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... Find a thing and pop it out. Note that I still hadn't learnt my lesson with that damn pliers tool yet :/

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Hex key works much better :). It pushing on it doesn't work, use the heavy end of a pair of pliers or a small hammer to tap it out. Try to use the thickest hex key that will fit in the hole to avoid causing it damage by using a too thin one.

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With the roll pin removed, the shackle will pop out as before:

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Undo the screws, take out the key, pop off the bottom plate. All bits removed:

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You can see the BB sticking out into the hole with the lock locked (it's key retaining and you can see the keys on the table below). This will be your primary foil if you try to remove the keys before undoing both screws. If you have a thin enough screwdriver you might be able to make it, though:

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That gorgeous keyway.

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In the last set of lock photos (open shackle) I didn't photograph the core removal process as I was trying to figure it out. Here's some pics. Insert the key...

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Turn it 90°...

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Pull firmly.

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Levers! Discs! Leverdiscs!

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The open end, with the sidebar. Looks to be made of brass, pretty solid. The whole thing is pretty solid :D

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Hollow lock cylinder area with BBs...

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Get back in there!

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All the bits.

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Reassembling. Another shot of that keyway:

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Reassembled lock porn.

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Much smoother on the roll pin hole this time! Learnt my lesson, heh.

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Ok, that's it for that post! Consider your Ingersoll open & closed shackle journies complete!
<<

stefan042

User avatar

Newbie

Posts: 18

Joined: Wed Dec 02, 2015 3:20 pm

Location: New York

Post Tue Dec 22, 2015 11:35 am

Re: LocksportSouth's Stash

Nice, very cool lock.
<<

LocksportSouth

User avatar

Active Member

Posts: 369

Joined: Thu Dec 03, 2015 12:51 am

Location: UK

Post Tue Dec 22, 2015 11:39 am

Re: LocksportSouth's Stash

Thank you :). I don't have the same "history" with Ingersolls as I do with Rukos and CISAs but I fell in love as soon as I saw one.. Love at first sight and all that :D. I do feel extremely lucky to have a collection of them now. More Ingersoll related goodness to follow soon.... ;)
<<

LocksportSouth

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Active Member

Posts: 369

Joined: Thu Dec 03, 2015 12:51 am

Location: UK

Post Tue Dec 22, 2015 8:52 pm

Re: LocksportSouth's Stash

FINALLY! Along with my other CISA padlocks, I ordered the 283/62, a closed shackle but traditional (not shutter / straight shackle) padlock. Unfortunately it was lost in the post and after a follow up with the seller they sent another one out which arrived a couple of days back. Here we go again!

The familier box:

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Numbers and diagram:

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The lock and keys. It's pretty much identical to the other CISAs except for the shackle and form factor - same rugged exterior, same logo stamping, same type of keys, same 1/4 turn tight keyway with super-smooth action and zero spring (dead core), same keyway bottom plate.. But this one, I could remove :D

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Key bitting:

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Lock front:

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Bottom of the lock including bottom plate, drillproof rotating disk and drainage hole:

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Closer look at the shackle shrouding and body. Nice thick shoulders should put paid to any cutting :D

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Key going in. Nice selection of grooves there:

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Key in, locked:

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Short turn, and it's unlocked:

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Lock open:

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Down inside the open shackle hole - flat head screw holds the bottom plate in place.

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For some reason I forgot to photograph removing the bottom plate. Oh well. Here's the shackle BB and actuator off to the side:

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Down inside the empty cylinder hole (screw end on the left is what keeps the bottom plate in. Note also the large groove on the front right hand wide just inside the hole where a ridge on the bottom plate keeps the other side in).

Note also in the smaller cutout part where the cylinder goes, where's a little black hole at the back? For some unfathomable reason there's actually a hole here but right through to the other side, into the shackle hole. Probably not a BIG security concern but it's got to be a manufacturing defect or damage :(. I would try and send it back but have already had enough issues with even getting this lock, that's what I get buying from eBay I guess!

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Shackle removed.

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Ball bearings and actuator with offset bar that fits into the end of the cylinder:

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The cylinder itself. Look at those grooves! Dayum. The two small holes in either side are for fitting the anti drill plate (which has a pin on only one side, allowing it to spin around the core and frustrate drilling attempts):

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Top down. Only 5 pins!

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Back of the cylinder with the notch to fit into the actuator bar (a few pics above):

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Bottom plate (left) and anti-drill disk (right). Note the single pin in this as I mentioned before. The screw hole on the bottom plate goes about 1/2 way through the plate on the wider side and in the middle, so that's probably the weak point for a drilling attack:

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All the parts, from left to right: Body, shackle, cylinder, (top) anti drill plate, bottom piece, (bottom) BBs and actuator (as they would fit inside the lock)

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Bottom plate, anti-drill disk, cylinder and actuator assembled:

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Re-assembled and lookin' nice :D

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Aaaaand we're done. That's all the Cisas for now, probably ever as I don't think they make many others. Thanks for sticking with me! :)
<<

LocksportSouth

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Active Member

Posts: 369

Joined: Thu Dec 03, 2015 12:51 am

Location: UK

Post Wed Dec 23, 2015 12:42 am

Re: LocksportSouth's Stash

What's this shiny new suspiciously Ingersoll looking box, I wonder? ;)

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Why, it's the Extra-Closed shackle variety :)

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Shiny!

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Dat weather seal plug <3

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Open!

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That hole on the side is a water drain, not a roll pin. Due to the super-high shoulders the lock must be open shackle, making disassembly much easier (it uses the same screw-in-each-side bottom plate as the other Ingersolls):

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Very tight access - guessing only a chain link or carefully made hasp and staple will fit this:

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Those crazy thick shoulders :D

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The keys:

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The keyway:

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Key inserted:

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Unlocked and shackle removed:

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Not sure what happened to this Ingersoll - whether this is an artifact of the lock's creation, or some damage (looks like fire damage) that has occured afterwards, but it's blackened and golden inside the shackle area:

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The shackle, removed:

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Down inside the shackle holes you can see the phillips screws that you'll need to remove to get the bottom plate off. One on each side.

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As with the others, the BB will get in the way if you lock it while doing this:

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Screws removed, bottom plate ready for disassembly:

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Bits and bobs, bottom plate removed:

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Cylinder:

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Remove the same way as the others :). Insert key, turn 90°, pull out:

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You can see the sidebar compressed here:

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Also comes out at other angles, such as here:

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Escaping shackle BB inside the empty lock cylinder area:

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The cylinder, with all it's levers. Actuator on the end:

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Re-inserting:

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All done!

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<<

LocksportSouth

User avatar

Active Member

Posts: 369

Joined: Thu Dec 03, 2015 12:51 am

Location: UK

Post Wed Dec 23, 2015 2:22 pm

Re: LocksportSouth's Stash

Last Ingersoll for now - promise! :D It's a doozy, though.

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Cool lil vintage (laminate plate style) closed shackle Ingersoll. Compared with today's modern Ingersolls, it's somewhere between the closed and extra closed shackle. Open on both sides but the shackle top is totally covered. That's not all that's special about this one, though....

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One side of the key. "US Property, Do Not Duplicate". If my understanding is correct, that makes this US stamped lock a military issue :). You'll notice that the lock itself and the key are a little grimy - we'll be taking care of that soon...

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Other side of the key:

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It has some paint patched at various points but otherwise looks in good, if "used" condition:

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Bottom plate of the lock reads:
Made in U.S.A
Miracle Lock Corp
Sub.Liquidonics Industries INC


PATS. PEND.
UN/LIC. Ingersoll Locks G.B
U.S.


A few interesting thoughts about this:

1. Note that the bottom plate doesn't have a weather guard slider or bottom plate like the other Ingersolls, but instead has a pre-cut opening for the keyway and two welded screw guards instead of one. I'm not sure if that's the case with ALL of these old style Ingersolls or just these US ones.

2. The keyway looks different - it's much more like a regular keyway than the new wavey style, although keys are still double sided and the mechanism seems broadly the same.

3. I assume this is a US military lock given the stamping, I haven't looked much into Sub. Liquidonics Industries or Miracle Lock yet, but the "Made in USA" is interesting as I know that Ingersolls are British locks and the modern ones are all stamped made in England. Therefore, either it used to be that all old style Ingersolls were made in the US, or these special US ones were contracted out to a different manufacturer in the US, but using the Ingersoll designs.

This is a drain hole, not a roll pin or grub screw hole:

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Top half of the lock showing the shackle and lock shoulders:

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There's a printed blue lable inside which reads "A30". I assume that's the location / part number / whatever for tracking this lock wherever it was installed. It's hella grimy and dirty in there:

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The key feels gritty and crunchy both inserting and turning. Here's the shackle, also in a bit of a state:

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Straight down view of the top:

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Sorry for the bad lighting, I have a LOT of issues getting light inside this shackle hole so you can see the screw inside:

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Yuck, what a mess:

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Gritty, grimy screws that surprisingly came out fine and weren't rusted at all:

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Key in the lock:

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You might be wondering how you can access the cylinder in this lock, since the bottom is completely smooth (no retaing plate) and the top is equally well sealed. At first I thought it was a sealed unit, but the two screws deep inside the shackle holes convinced me that this can't be true. Probably would have been easier to figure out if it wasn't stuck together with grime.

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If you look carefully at the bottom 3 or so laminated plated, you'll see that there is a small gap before the rest of the plates. This is actually the bottom piece of the lock and comes away as one piece. First you need to undo both of the screws inside the shackle holes, and then you can pry this bottom piece off with a small screwdriver:

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There's your bottom plate! Note how the cylinder is fairly similar to the new ones except for the squarer keyway. Hella grimy and dirty though.

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Bottom plate from the bottom:

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Bottom plate from the inside:

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Cylinder:

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Cylinder removal:

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As I said - looks pretty familiar. I guess "If it works, don't fix it" :)

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Sidebar:

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Inside. Poor lock :(

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The bottom of the cylinder is stamped with "U.S.P and a UID - 12480. I assume this is so that if the cylinder is replaced or drilled out and then replaced, anyone inspecting the plug will know that it has been tampered with. Not sure what USP would be. United States... Something. A quick Google gives me This, but I'm not sure if that's right, or why they'd need a military padlock. I assume it's not the postal service (USPS), Navy (USN), Air Force (USAF) or Army (I think they are normally just stamped U.S.). If anyone can shed any light on this, feel free to do so :).

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BBs loose inside the bottom of the cylinder hole. Despite all the grime in this lock, the BBs were actually the one part with no stickyness or lube at all - typical!

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They said, they weren't clean:

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All the bits of the lock thus far (minus the ball bearings). The round washer sits in the bottom plate..... I assume as an anti-drill plate? Doesn't seem particularly strong though so it might just be to assist the cylinder in turning and key it from rubbing on the bottom plate.

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With all the bits out, I decided to give it a clean off. Not really knowing where to start or what to use (aside from knowing that WD-40 = good cleaner, bad lube, and actually having some lock lube), I grabbed some gloves, a large glass bowl, plenty of tissues and a microfibre cloth, a can of spray WD40, some thick silicone paste lube and a can of Tri-flow and set to work.

First I took the body, BBs, shackle, screws, bottom plate and washer and gave them all a thorough squirting with the WD-40 (trying to avoid my keyboard and monitor!) and left the body to sit in a small pool of WD-40 in the bowl whilst vigorously rubbing the smaller parts with the cloth / gloves and WD-40. Protip BTW: WD-40 disintegrates latex gloves. They will literally fall apart in your hands upon exposure to WD-40 and a little friction. Once the small parts were cleaned off as best as I could do, I put them aside and sprayed the body a bit more, also using it as a topical spray to hit problem points and then rub with the cloth. Also used cotton buds (Q-tips) and the cloth to get at the inside of the shackle holes, and when that was done as best as possible, I dried off the body the same way (cloth, tissues and cotton buds).

As for the cylinder itself, I WD-40d the actuator end (being careful not to get any in the cylinder itself) and then blasted the cylinder innards from all angles (both side cutouts and down the keyway) with Tri-Flow, and then used the key to zip in and out a load and get all the oily black gunk out. Made a bit of a mess in the bathroom, oops!

I then left them to sit on some tissue for a while before whacking a load of Silicone grease on the BBs, shackle cutouts and all over the end of the cylinder actuator, and more Tri-flow in the cylinder itself.

As I say, I'm a total noob at cleaning locks (this was my first attempt) but it looks a lot better and feels a lot nicer (no grit / crunch on key enter, turning or shackle removing) than it did before. The outside could still use a LOT of improvement though so maybe that'll be a project for another day :)

Inside cleaned:

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Various gubbins:

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Bottom plate - bottom:

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Cylinder (pre lube):

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All put back together:

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Looking much nicer:

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The bottom, all cleaned up:

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And that's it for my Ingersoll adventure! Like the Cisas, I have pretty much all of these now so aside from stumbling upon something very different, or deciding it's worth paying full manufacturer priced for the 12mm shackle version of the closed shackle one, that's probably it for me and Ingersolls :). Thanks for joining me!
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