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My problem boils down to the case where I cannot buy a comb blade and do not have a milling machine to make one. Further to that , to be able to impression all locks, then different blades would be required to suit different key ways.

One solution would be to make the comb keys from standard steel key blanks and possibly thin them down a little by fly cutting. So we really need a milling machine for cutting the slots and the thinning operation. I know that people do break blanks while impressioning (mainly soft brass), but have a feeling that , it might produce a longer lasting blade. If the spare blades were available at reasonable cost, then one would not have to make them, or even buy the tool set, as it would be easy enough to make a handle.

I think as impressioning progresses, it would be nice to purchase a UK version, if one could be produced at reasonable cost .... which I doubt.

Last night I was wondering about modifying a comb pick, but that would not work because it would never go into a Yale Y2 key way, so fabricating the blades from key blanks appears to remain an option.

I wonder what the UK suppliers could do about this ?. Would it be a viable product ?. Direct impressioning does have the advantage that a working key is the end result.

Right idea, wrong pitch and cuts need to be a bit deeper.

here is falles style of foil impressioning.



I clipped this a bit ago, hope yall like it

I could see no reference to how many different comb tools are provided . The tool has to fit the key way as well as the pin spacing. I can see foil impressioning keys becoming more popular than even bump keys, yet none of the UK suppliers seem to have latched on yet. A bit odd because a minutes work turns a 30 pence blank into a desirable £10 tool.

Anyone in UK got a key cutting machine for sale ?.

as far as falles comb pick style blank they may not be able to make it due to patent issues... idk how all that works

but the idea fo making one per profile is buzzeling that noone has mass produced it like bump keys.

maybe you could be the first

only reason i can think of is someone else holds the patent for that... might be worth looking into though

Both patents mentioned in the text, were taken out by William E Martin of Martin and Starchuk. That was the company who sold the kit of plastic comb tools. The 1983 patent was for foil and the 1989 patent for a lead insert, but I have no idea if they are still current. Falle seemed to have got away with it, despite the 'prior art'.

but falles clientel is in no way going to complain about patent infringment... so either way we still dont know lol.

what is your plan... to contact uk lockpickers and sk them to make it since you do not have the tools... (not a terrable idea)

Even if the patent is still running, individuals are allowed to make a copy for their own purposes. Well they would be dead simple to make using the right width of mortise cutting wheels in a key duplicating machine. The brass blanks cut like a dream. We can see what UKlockpicker says when he comes on. I did think about making a little machine to cut them .... just for my own use.

if you do start manufacturing some for ur own use... I may be in the market for several profiles if ur up to doing that aswall... my only duplicator runs on 220 so i cant use it here

I could use it here in UK Hi!

tru lol... i got it in iraq right b4 i left... never used it... it looks barely used then put on a sehlf to collect dust... and in iraq it collected alot of dust

Second attempt. Clamped key skew-wiff but have not jigged up for that yet. Yale Y2, first cut from shoulder 0.206", pin spacing 0.165". Key cannot enter key way beyond first pin. The end reason is that the key is 'too short', which explains why the experts use a shim, with key based tools. Come to think of it so does the Martin and Starchuk tools. Falle got round it in a different way. There is a work-around for the key problem, I will try that next. The bottom key is the latest.

William Martin patented his version of foil impressioning in 1983. In 1989 he then patents the lead insert method and I am wondering why. I have noticed that some people have trouble getting the shim in and that can screw up the foil, could that have been the reason for the move ?.

with all the modification you are doing 2 the keys I haf an idea...
what if you took a peterson miniknife and bent the blade at a 90 drgree angle 2 the handle. Then filed the keyblade a bit thinner so you could insert the miniknife raise the pins to max, insert the key, remove the miniknife, impression, insert the miniknife and raise... Remove key...

little to no work thinning the key that small amount...

Yes Sir, that would work OK . Despite the foil I think there is room in the key way for the shim and the key .... and also the option of making room for it, without milling a flat groove. Either way the DIY guy is still stuck with using key blanks, so I wanted to see if it can be done without the shim.

The problem is that the first pin rides up the nose of the key and hits the relatively steep slope (about 45 degree's) of the foil between the first and second teeth. The slope is too steep for the pin to ride up so it presses sideways (shear) into the foil, puncturing it ..... and then jams up against the second tooth. In the Falle tool the first tooth is the same height as the rest and the first pin rides up the metal comb, instead of the foil.

On the bottom key I cut some metal off the shoulder .... which moves all the teeth to the right, in order to gain some spare metal at the tip, so that the first tooth is as high as the rest. I am doing this on an old lathe as I do not have a milling machine and although I have solved the teeth spacing problem (with a DTI rig), I am am having problems setting up the first cut from the shoulder. As you can see, by removing a little more of the shoulder should fix it (it says here ).

Just to copper my bet, I have emailed a UK bump key company and they are planning to get in on the act, so one way or another, it will be possible to get to the bottom of it.

Old age taking it's toll again !. I can use the DTI jig, to set up the first cut from shoulder !.