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Picking idea for Gemii magnetic

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entropy

Familiar Face

Posts: 43

Joined: Mon Jan 24, 2011 3:32 am

Location: Portland, OR

Post Thu Feb 27, 2014 2:58 am

Picking idea for Gemii magnetic

Gemii magnetic lock. It took way too long to cut this open because I kept cutting deep into the structural elements. But once I hit the magic cut, the cover actually popped right off.

mag-top.jpg


When you pull up the shackle this plate with holes in it rises up to the pins. With the key in place, the pins will be lined up with the holes.

mag-holes.jpg


Here's the key. It's easily decoded with magnetic field viewing film (that's two pictures there the film has to be right on the key).

mag-key.jpg


And here's an idea for picking. I've taped some of the magnetic viewing film on the spot where the key goes. If you bring a magnet near and shake it about, the pins will rattle around and you can see this on the film. Now, pull on the shackle and one of the pins will bind. Then when you shake the magnet you can see that this pin doesn't rattle. The idea is to start building up a key, getting each pin into a way such that it doesn't bind. The difficulty is that pins that are correctly set (so they'd be in the holes) can only jiggle a tiny bit and this is hard to see on the film. They will look like they're binding unless you have a real keen eye. The viewing film is pretty ghostly so it can be a bit hard to tell what's going on.

mag-view.jpg


Of course if you pick it with some other method like http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pFY3y8l3qe4 then you can use the viewing film to decode. This film is pretty fun, like $10, and you can even use it to read credit card magstripes.
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GWiens2001

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Lock-Goblin-Gordon
Lock-Goblin-Gordon

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Post Thu Feb 27, 2014 3:26 am

Re: Picking idea for Gemii magnetic

Very interesting. Have been tempted to make mine into a cutaway for my son to see. Maybe will do it anyway once a second one comes into my collection. It is a cool lock to see the internal components.

Thanks for the post!

Gordon
Just when you think you've learned it all, that is when you find you haven't learned anything yet.
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fgarci03

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Post Thu Feb 27, 2014 3:43 am

Re: Picking idea for Gemii magnetic

Very ingenious dude!

You actually found a method o SPP this lock :mrgreen:
How much do time do you rekon you take to pick it like this, more or less?

Thanks for sharing!
Go ahead, keep plugging away, picking on me! You will end up on bypass or with rigor mortise.
- GWiens2001
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GWiens2001

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Lock-Goblin-Gordon
Lock-Goblin-Gordon

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Location: Arizona, United States

Post Thu Feb 27, 2014 3:49 am

Re: Picking idea for Gemii magnetic

Used to pick these using four magnets. Takes a little time, but faster than picking even a medium-security lock. A minute or two tops.

Gordon
Just when you think you've learned it all, that is when you find you haven't learned anything yet.
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entropy

Familiar Face

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Joined: Mon Jan 24, 2011 3:32 am

Location: Portland, OR

Post Thu Feb 27, 2014 1:20 pm

Re: Picking idea for Gemii magnetic

fgarci: Well, I haven't actually tried picking it yet. I need a way to make tryout keys. Perhaps magnets stuck to tape? I'll try it out when I get some time.
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fgarci03

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Post Thu Feb 27, 2014 1:50 pm

Re: Picking idea for Gemii magnetic

Unless there is only a small number of possible key combinations, no need to get try-out keys...

Gordon says it's easy and fast... That means that for the rest of us mortals, it's moderately difficult! :whip: :mrgreen:
So with a little practice, you'll be able to pick it pretty quickly with just 1 magnet and the film for viewing what is binding and whatnot.

Whatever you do, don't forget to update the post, it's a really interesting find you got there!
Go ahead, keep plugging away, picking on me! You will end up on bypass or with rigor mortise.
- GWiens2001
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rai

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Post Thu Feb 27, 2014 3:52 pm

Re: Picking idea for Gemii magnetic

If you tear that key apart, there are four magnets as you know by the film, and each is set on one edge of a plastic hexagon so that the magnets have six different positions

I was once going to make my key into a pick with the addition of a second magent opposite the one in the plastic hexagon, and set to the opposite polarity

I was going to put both polarities on the hexagons and then cut them to almost round so it could be rotated and sort of click stop when the hexagon is aligned. and of course some kind of knob to turn them.

other than thinking of this many years ago, I have done nothing to actually make one .

if you found a piece of wooden dowel in the diameter to almost span the key width, and on each end put a magent with the polarities different on both ends of the dowel, you would have a pick that you could use to place and rotate to pick it.

that dowel is something i came up with just now thinking about it.

or if you had a stick of reversable electro magnets you could get a computer or a arduino or Pi to run through the combinations

four magnets two polarities and six positions.

6 positions on the hexagon and two polarities, thats 6x2 or twelve positions, in each of 4 places, is that 12 to the forth power?

or is it more complex? positions plus polarites plus 4 positions,

This little lock does its job well, the shackle is not huge, and the lock can be defeated, but usually by destructive means, and isnt that what locks do, hold something secure or make it obvious that someone has broken in. So that the damage shows that it has been broken into.

if you have a really small compass, it might be possible to see which magnets are south and which are north, the film dosent show that does it?

I would also try to use something like a magnetic pickup microphone such as are fairly cheap in the chinese lockpick sites.
use it to listen for the very tiny noise of that pin hitting the hole.
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kilae

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Newbie

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Joined: Sun May 12, 2013 6:06 pm

Location: Switzerland

Post Sat Dec 13, 2014 3:57 pm

Re: Picking idea for Gemii magnetic

Nice padlock!

Is the SIMA padlock the same building?
Image

Has the Gemii also no rivets?

So many questions! :smile:
Mess with the best, die like the rest!

I search: All magnetic locks, Trioving locks, MIWA, Xylok, Pollux, Fichet, MAXiS, AVA Wafer Lock, teicocil, S&G 951, ...
I have: Swiss locks like Sea, kaba and keso, Miracle magnetic lock and some more
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entropy

Familiar Face

Posts: 43

Joined: Mon Jan 24, 2011 3:32 am

Location: Portland, OR

Post Sat Dec 13, 2014 7:12 pm

Re: Picking idea for Gemii magnetic

Your SIMA lock looks different from Gemii. For one thing, it looks to be much better quality. And I don't know what that little circle is just to the left of the SIMA logo on the lock.

But yes, the Gemii has no rivets. At least none that are visible from the outside. There are posts in two (maybe three) corners, which are probably some sort of rivet, but somehow the rivet heads are covered up and inaccessible. But the thing is probably not hard to open if you know just where to cut. I didn't know where to cut so it took me forever to open it.

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