My first manipulation :)

[innerpicked]

Thanks to the help of Daggers book and a bit of advice from PhoneMan, I managed to get my first safe lock open, a Sargent Greenleaf 6725. According to the casting date it was made in March of 1963, no relockers present in the lock.




Opening combo, LRL 72 12 32.5

[Anarchy_won]

congratulations

[GWiens2001]

Fantastic! Very nice!

What I am not clear on is why your contact points are at roughly 55 and 63? Do you have the spindle splined at the correct position? (VL instead of VR, or UP instead of DN).

Also notice that your readings get further apart at the combination numbers. That indicates to my (not-very-experienced) eye that the nose is not dropping into the cam as far, meaning that there is no gate there. Are you recording the numbers right, or does this safe lock model just different from the half dozen or so models I have worked with?

Here is a picture of a graph that I use, as an example of what I mean about the contact points getting closer at the numbers. The graph is from an S&G 6730.



Gordon

[flywheel]

Nice opening Quick opening!

His RCP and LCP are graphed on opposite sides of the sheets making it appear the lows are further apart.

That is a crazy graph from GW. My largest drop was 1 point at the gate and the rest of the graph was smooth.

[innerpicked]

The spindle is in a VL confiquration, may be why my cp readings look to go in the opposite direction. I was surprised by the flatness of the RCP graphs. Could this lock have better machine work causing less eradic readings?

[GWiens2001]

I see what you mean on the placement of the numbers opposite. Should have seen that.

However, think your lock may be mounted VR, and splined VL. It would explain the contact point numbers being about 50 off.

That graph of mine is crazy, because it was one of my first graphs. Was still learning. When I needed a picture to show what I meant, just grabbed the first one in the folder.

Strangely enough, that graph gave me all three numbers in the first full rotation! Never had that happen since on a different lock, but it was repeatable with that lock, even when I change the combo. No longer have that particular 6730. It was pretty much trashed.

Gordon

[Oldfast]

Congrats innerpicked! Exciting stuff And lots of learning goin' on.

....I was surprised by the flatness of the RCP graphs. Could this lock have better machine work causing less eradic readings?

It's actually probably a good thing that your first lock didn't give you huge indications
cause we tend to look for that next time, and end up missing more subtle changes.

I tend to think that the tolerances (or lack thereof) can sometimes work for us or against us.
You might get another lock (same model) and find the gates read as deep obvious craters.
Also, as your touch becomes more refined, so too will the indications on your graphs.

[femurat]

Welcome on-board mate! I'm happy to see new members trying manipulation.

Cheers

[davewhitejr]

Good job!

[jharveee]

I noticed your second graph is only 0 - 25?
Guessing AWR.
Wondering why you didn't need to graph the whole wheel?
When I did my first manipulation AWR Graph #2 I started at 100 and worked towards 0.
I Graphed the whole wheel.......was I spinning the wrong direction?
Did you start at 32 and work your way down?
Just starting to spin so forgive my confusion.
Thanks

[innerpicked]

I noticed your second graph is only 0 - 25?
Guessing AWR.
Wondering why you didn't need to graph the whole wheel?
When I did my first manipulation AWR Graph #2 I started at 100 and worked towards 0.
I Graphed the whole wheel.......was I spinning the wrong direction?
Did you start at 32 and work your way down?
Just starting to spin so forgive my confusion.
Thanks

The reason I did not graph the whole wheel was because I got a perfect gate signature on that wheel, as it matched the gate signature on graph 1. I started at 0 and worked to 100, s thats what Daggers book said. This lock was easy as it indicated wheel 1, 2 then 3.

[Oldfast]

....This lock was easy as it indicated wheel 1, 2 then 3.

Just the opposite actually. 3, 2, then 1.
The gate you found first (32.5) was wheel 3.
Then you found the gate (12) for wheel 2.

The wheel closest to the drive cam is always considered w3.
It's the last one to be positioned & corresponds to the final # of your combination.
Wheel 1 will always be the furthest from the drive cam & corresponds to the first number of the combination.

You obviously have all this straight in your minds eye cause your manipulation went perfcectly. Textbook opening.
I only make mention of the terminology because discussions go much better when we're all on the same page