LC on manipulation tour: Collector Warehouse

[Libertyclicks]

Hello pickers and spinners.
I haven't even turned a dial in a week or so, but I got some new goodies to play with and got re-energized to attack some safes. I still intend to return to my previous adventures at the scrap yard, but I stumbled on another little gem of safe practice.

I contacted a person who is advertising "Many safes for sale". His ad sounded strange and convoluted, and the address was in a bad part of town, so I was a little skeptical. I went to check the place out and it has nothing to do with safes or locks or anything that I would consider a likely place to find safes. Oh well, a wise man once said you have to shoot to score so I gave him a call. After getting over a language barrier , we set an appointment and I arrived to see the shop.

I'll spare the details, but basically the guy is one badass hoarder and in his collection are indeed "many safes". My rough estimation is around 30 safes, but half of them are buried under boxes of valueless crap. I put in a half hour of work just to get to one that was 3 wheel and still closed. Brinks, Taylor, Star. A wide assortment of S&G, LaGard, Taylor, Diebold, Chubb, etc. Some electronic locks, but mostly mechanical. He is not so much interested in the combo as he is having them open. I imagine he thinks he will find a million dollars in one of them and then he can retire. I have no fantasies that these boxes are loaded with money, but if I was to open one and find something of value, I intend to relock it and excuse myself outside to call the police in case any of this is shady. If he produces the receipt for sale of said safe or we can check that the boxes aren't stolen somehow then fair enough. I'm pretty sure a thief wouldn't be holding on to such a comprehensive safe collection, and they would have just drilled them open by now right?

He is a tough guy to deal with, his warehouse is a total dive and it is clear he doesn't like spending too much time there and neither would I, but I am allowed to come spin to my hearts content when he is around. I took a few pictures, but as always I wish I took more, and I will do next time I have the displeasure of dirtying my clothes climbing through his stuff.

If you're reading this and you like safes, then I'd love your input on S&G 4 wheel locks. He has 9 Brinks safes with S&G locks with privacy dials (spyproof) which I think have 4 wheels.
I say "I think" because each lock had almost unnoticeable change in resistance when I was counting wheels. They are very very light to the touch, I feel no resistance on the right contact point at all, and left is very faint. The only feedback I get from the RCP is a little tick noise if I pass it quickly and the room is quiet and I sit right up against the box. I wonder if these are manipulation resistant 4 wheel locks, or worse, group 1 locks. I guess these kind of locks a stethoscope would actually help. I graphed one lock just for a try and I'll try to upload that soon. Also picture of the brinks safe in question shortly.

So glad to see so much interest in mechanical combination locks lately. I really, REALLY wish some of you guys lived in Toronto to give me a hand with all these manipulations I keep stumbling on and am not equipped to tackle. Cheers to the all pickers and spinners.
LibertyClicks

[femurat]

Buy me a ticket and I'll fly there to help you

[Squelchtone]

Make sure a friend or family member knows the address where you are going and a time to expect you home or a check in time. No need to get mugged or beat over the head with a pipe from behind while hunched over a safe in some guys dodgy warehouse.

That out of the way... you are so lucky to find interesting places like this! Do you think these safes are all pulls from gas stations and convenience stores? Can't wait to see the photos.

Happy dialing,
Squelchtone

[Oldfast]

30+ safes Oh shit... here we go again!! Cannot wait to follow along LC. Exciting stuff.

Make sure a friend or family member knows the address where you are going and a time to expect you home or a check in time.

+1 on that. Good call Squelch!

[Libertyclicks]

Buy me a ticket and I'll fly there to help you

Hahaha I would really like to do that, but I don't think Italian air fare is in the cards for me hahaha. Maybe if it was driveable I'd pay gas to someone who could teach me a few things and help with these safes. Plus cash for any openings.

Make sure a friend or family member knows the address where you are going and a time to expect you home or a check in time. No need to get mugged or beat over the head with a pipe from behind while hunched over a safe in some guys dodgy warehouse.

Yeah good call. When I saw the place I called my friend and explained what I was doing, naturally he said "Just get the hell out of there if you have a bad feeling" but I was curious and figured I would at least meet the guy face to face. I'll keep that friend in the loop, and the misses usually knows where I'm going .

here we go again!! Cannot wait to follow along LC. Exciting stuff.

Haha if only I had your hands Mike this would go a lot faster! Oh well, still learning.
Always keen to hear feedback from you guys, thanks for the interest. Pics uploading soon, but have to go to my day job(sigh).

LC

[fgarci03]

I'm waiting for you to say you DID find a million dollars in one of the safes

[Libertyclicks]

If I do find a million bucks, I promise to send each of you fine gentleman a nice gift.

[fgarci03]

If I do find a million bucks, I promise to send each of you fine gentleman a nice gift.

If someone starts kissing your ass in the next few days, you will know why now!



LC, you are such a good friend, you share so much knowledge. KP wouldn't be the same without you. I hope you stick around so I can learn from you, as I really admire what you do for this community




P.S. - What I said, appart for being a joke, doesn't make it any less true!

Ha!

[Libertyclicks]

OK... Images uploaded. Let me know about the sizes again guys, I think they are ok but what works for my net connection might not be good for yours.
Many brinks units. Most of the brinks boxes he has are the same size, colour, setup, etc. Almost all have these privacy dial S&G locks. I find them all very difficult to read and that kept me pretty humble about my progress.

This one I worked on a bit to start.


This one even has your name on it Mike!

I tried the combo, didn't work LRL or RLR. Was worth a shot. I don't think any of these are even 3 wheel but I can't feel jack on them.

Ahhhaa! A nice normal looking front reading S&G 3 wheeler.

Oh good, I actually get feedback from it and I can graph it...

I got 2 "low" areas in there, one had an actual gate like shape, I was all ready late for my other work, but I just wanted to do hi lo for my interest to experiment. But I did it a little different. I think fgarcie is trying it this way, put the good number on one wheel at a time and check for good reading, rather than a "bad" number on one wheel and see when the good indication disappears.
While we're on the subject I guess the risk of doing hi lo this way is if you set another wheel to a number that unfortunately gives a hi spot then it could shadow your good reading and really trip you up. Normally hi los take me a couple minutes to figure out and actually jot down the results, I am pleased to say that I did my checks here in under a minute. That was my victory for the day (It's the little things in life).
Anyway, sure enough wheel 3 read very good, wheel 1 read awful, and wheel 2 slightly worse than average.

A nice CMT safe. Identical to the one I worked on at the scrapyard.... except...

This one has the cash boxes inside still.

Interesting they are each S&G locked also, probably just bolt locked into the left side of the safe. One drill would pop them off but I can probably crack those... He says he doesn't care about this safe. I assume he knows there is nothing in those all ready.

The Shop Front

This is a "Delivery Company". They also sell thermometers, and will pierce your ears if you buy earrings. Also they have a friendly sign stating actions speak louder than words... WTF???

Next course of action:
1) Research S&G 4 wheel locks. I think these ones may be 3 wheels but with a roller at the very least to make it manip resistant. If it IS 4 wheel or has a roller then all those units will be left till last.
2) Take pictures of every safe I can access without significant effort.
3) Brinks L446 w1 L0 w2 Raround w3 L44. Failing any good readings there than anticipate w3 @ L64 and w2 R around.

LibertyClicks

P.S. I spoke with a Brinks rep to try to determine if these are publicly available units or if they are tracked in any way. I thought they may have a database somewhere that can be queried to see if they are stolen or something. It was a very long and awkward conversation, but apparently they are going to run the serial numbers to see if everything is legit here.

[Oldfast]

That CMT safe!!!! HahAAAA... all those dials lined up and bent over for the taking. How sexy!!!

That first safe... the dial looks pretty similar to the 6700 I made my cut-away with.

So both graphs you showed, you parked 1&2 @ zero and ran 3?

You mentioned a stethoscope may be helpful. I'd imagine it would. Not necessarily for manipulation....
but certainly would help with initial diagnosis - lever loaded, flys intact, how many wheels, etc.
My girl surprised me with a real nice one she picked up from a medical supply store for around $20.
What a gal! Haven't found alot of use for it yet, but I know it'll come in handy. Maybe it'd help you?

Thanks for sharing LC! I REALLY enjoy following along
p.s. Your picture sizes look fine to me (at least on my computer)

[fgarci03]

That is amazing!

It's like wonderworld with safes! I'm so jealous
On the 2nd images the safe has a keyway. Is there a key for it? Or you'll have to pick it?

Thanks for sharing LC

[Libertyclicks]

So both graphs you showed, you parked 1&2 @ zero and ran 3?

Yes, both safes I tried just the third wheel (last wheel) to start.
I did one practice manip. to get back in the swing before going to this place. I found two gates just free spinning my practice S&G lock, but I was having trouble finding the "true centres". For example : I measure 67.5 and I see a rise. 70 there is a drop, so then I go back and measure 67 68 69 70 71 72. 68 through 71 are equally low in my eyes then it rises again. I call the centre 69.5 and start the next wheel. But after looking inside I see the gate isn't at 69.5, it would have to be at 71 or 72 to drop in. This was also a problem for me when I started but that was partly because of rotation conversion. I'm not sure why it's such an issue now, but I'm worried that would cause me problems "in the wild".

On the 2nd images the safe has a keyway. Is there a key for it? Or you'll have to pick it?

He doesn't have keys for these ones so I better brush up on my picking as well.

LC

[Oldfast]

It looks like there was a handle on it at some point before it was replaced with a lock? hmmm

[femurat]

I just wanted to do hi lo for my interest to experiment. But I did it a little different. I think fgarci is trying it this way, put the good number on one wheel at a time and check for good reading, rather than a "bad" number on one wheel and see when the good indication disappears.
While we're on the subject I guess the risk of doing hi lo this way is if you set another wheel to a number that unfortunately gives a hi spot then it could shadow your good reading and really trip you up. Normally hi los take me a couple minutes to figure out and actually jot down the results, I am pleased to say that I did my checks here in under a minute. That was my victory for the day (It's the little things in life).

Exactly my thought. But if it works go for it. If you have trouble this way it's not a big issue to make another test the more traditional way.

Cheers

[jeffmoss26]

Interesting pictures! That store looks...ummm...unique?