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My First Post - My First Manipulation - My Thanks!

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femurat

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Post Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:37 am

Re: My First Post - My First Manipulation - My Thanks!

WOW, congratulations for the opening! I'm happy my posts helped you somehow.

Keep playing and you'll be amazed on how much you can improve your skills. You can use your other safe to see how good and consistent you are when reading contact points. Try an AWL and an AWR graph and show us the results. It doesn't matter if you know the combo for a first test. Or even better buy an used S&G 6730, mount it on a wooden stand and start spinning!

Keep us posted.

Cheers :)
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ZTatZAU

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Post Tue Jun 11, 2019 10:40 pm

Re: My First Post - My First Manipulation - My Thanks!

femurat wrote:WOW, congratulations for the opening! I'm happy my posts helped you somehow.

Keep playing and you'll be amazed on how much you can improve your skills. You can use your other safe to see how good and consistent you are when reading contact points. Try an AWL and an AWR graph and show us the results. It doesn't matter if you know the combo for a first test. Or even better buy an used S&G 6730, mount it on a wooden stand and start spinning!

Keep us posted.

Cheers :)

Thanks Femurat! I appreciate your reply and your encouragement to this newbie!
Your "Getting Started" thread was one of the first things I read after stumbling upon this forum!
Please see my reply to your recent PM.

ZT
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femurat

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Post Wed Jun 12, 2019 8:11 am

Re: My First Post - My First Manipulation - My Thanks!

Oh, that tutorial, it was a long time ago, but I'm still proud of it!

I got no PM from you, and I didn't send you one. Are you sure it was me?

Cheers :)
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ZTatZAU

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Post Wed Jun 12, 2019 3:43 pm

Re: My First Post - My First Manipulation - My Thanks!

femurat wrote:Oh, that tutorial, it was a long time ago, but I'm still proud of it!

I got no PM from you, and I didn't send you one. Are you sure it was me?

Cheers :)
OOOPS! That's my mistake femurat!
I'm still trying to get to know everyone here! The PMs were exchanged with bitbuster. (Thanks again bitbuster!)

I haven't yet been diagnosed with Alzheimer's but I'm pretty sure I have a little Sometheimers!

ZT
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Oldfast

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OldddffAASSTT the Spin Master Extraordinaire and American Lock Slayer
OldddffAASSTT the Spin Master Extraordinaire and American Lock Slayer

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Post Wed Jun 12, 2019 9:18 pm

Re: My First Post - My First Manipulation - My Thanks!

Man, am I ever late to the party :D
Congrats ZT! Very exciting stuff!!
And welcome to the forum.

ZTatZAU wrote:. . . . I apologize for rambling on so about this but I do hope you all know how I'm feeling right now! I do welcome any comments anyone might have... especially as to what I could have (or should have) gleaned from any or all of my graphs that might have made this a bit easier!


Apologize?! You kiddin'? lol. We all appreciate you documenting and sharing this spin with us. And you've provided some great photos and commentary that made it a pleasure to follow along. In terms of any constructive criticism... I haven't much. The mistakes you made initially, I watched you research and correct toward the end. Namely graphing the drive wheel with the others even though you had already located its' gate. As soon as you began parking that at its' known gate prior to each reading, you received the info you needed for an opening.

And the zip-tie pointer, lol! Though it would seem too flimsy, it does have sufficient rigidity in the crucial directions (side-to-side/left-right movements). So why not?! Quick and convenient ... and it did the job! Actually pretty smart I'd say. And sure, as you mentioned, the longer the pointer the better fluctuations. But even with 3/16 changes, you noticed and utilized them for an opening. Very nice.


ZTatZAU wrote:. . . . I've confirmed the conversion numbers of 3 on wheel 2, and 9 on wheel 1 when switching from L-R-L to R-L-R.....
And, when switching from L to R number moves L (to a bigger number) and when switching from R to L number moves R (to a smaller number).
So my combo of L5-R55-L82 is equivalent to R14-L52-82 and either of these combos will open the safe.


Personally, my little pea-brain doesn't compute numbers real well... so I tryn' take a simplistic view on rotational conversions. Regardless of whether you're converting from L to R, or R to L... it's going to involve either (fixed) stopping short or (movable) going beyond the original number.

Fixed drive pins stack upon each other and add up. So each wheel will reach it's destination sooner than expecting when coming from the other direction. Regardless of what wheel(s) you're converting... when working with fixed drive pins always STOP SHORT/PRIOR TO the original number by the appropriate amount.

When you begin working with movable flys, you'll notice just the opposite - wheels lag behind, reaching their destination later than expected. This requires going PASSED/BEYOND the original number by the appropriate amount.


Thanks for sharing! I'm very excited for you(!) and definitely look forward to more.
I see you've started in on the Baum... I'll go have a look. Keep it up. And keep posting.
" Enjoy the journey AS MUCH as the destination."
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ZTatZAU

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Post Thu Jun 13, 2019 12:38 am

Re: My First Post - My First Manipulation - My Thanks!

Thanks Oldfast! I appreciate your reply, nice comments, and your encouragement! I've enjoyed reading many of your posts which are always very informative. Thanks too for explaining your view of rotational conversions which I've tucked away for future use!

I'd should add that, while I was initially motivated to open this safe so my son-in-law could find out what was in it, after watching Lonestar's Youtube video and then seeing your Sentry 1250 post and pictures, I was most curious to discover which variety of "drive cam connection" this safe had. (See my photos at the end of page 1).

Do you have any idea or thoughts on the purpose of the "slotted" drive cam connector on your Sentry 1250 and this one?

Please let me know! ZT
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Oldfast

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OldddffAASSTT the Spin Master Extraordinaire and American Lock Slayer
OldddffAASSTT the Spin Master Extraordinaire and American Lock Slayer

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Post Thu Jun 13, 2019 2:23 am

Re: My First Post - My First Manipulation - My Thanks!

Of the two previous photos you posted, I think you're correct in assuming both of those setups result in 4 different combos to choose from. If we're wrong, hopefully someone will chime in. As to the slotted portion on yours; I've been looking at it, but no, I just can't imagine what purpose it serves. Again, hopefully someone will enlighten us.
" Enjoy the journey AS MUCH as the destination."
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MartinHewitt

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Post Thu Jun 13, 2019 8:07 pm

Re: My First Post - My First Manipulation - My Thanks!

Is it really possible to use all four positions? The arm of the piece might cover the gate.
In case you wonder ... Martin Hewitt is a fictional detective in stories by Arthur Morrison:
Martin Hewitt, Investigator Chronicles of Martin Hewitt
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ZTatZAU

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Post Thu Jun 13, 2019 8:33 pm

Re: My First Post - My First Manipulation - My Thanks!

Oldfast wrote:Of the two previous photos you posted, I think you're correct in assuming both of those setups result in 4 different combos to choose from. If we're wrong, hopefully someone will chime in. As to the slotted portion on yours; I've been looking at it, but no, I just can't imagine what purpose it serves. Again, hopefully someone will enlighten us.
Thanks again Oldfast! I appreciate your continued feedback!

I may not have been clear in my previous post but while first researching the Sentry 1250, I had previously seen this slotted type "drive cam connector" (?) before opening my 1250. It was, in fact, in one of your 1250 posts on Page 5 of your "Safe Chronicles - Part II" and I've copied your image below to refresh your recollection.

Oldfasts's 1250 W3
Image
Do you happen to recall the (approximate) serial number of this safe?

In any case, I too am hopeful that someone else here will still chime in with an answer! I'm guessing that the slotted connector might be used on some Sentry models with an optional key lock to somehow prevent turning the dial at all unless the wheels are first unlocked with a key.

I'm also curious open the purpose of the large round "plugged opening" (?) on the opposite side of the T-handle bellcrank. Can anyone explain the purpose, or venture a guess as to what this additional "optional opening" might be for?

I don't mean to unnecessarily beat a dead horse with further discussion of this basic "fire-resistant box"; but rather just trying to add to my own personal knowledge base!

ZT
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MartinHewitt

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Post Thu Jun 13, 2019 8:37 pm

Re: My First Post - My First Manipulation - My Thanks!

Plug: For left-handed doors?
In case you wonder ... Martin Hewitt is a fictional detective in stories by Arthur Morrison:
Martin Hewitt, Investigator Chronicles of Martin Hewitt
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ZTatZAU

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Post Thu Jun 13, 2019 8:43 pm

Re: My First Post - My First Manipulation - My Thanks!

MartinHewitt wrote:Is it really possible to use all four positions? The arm of the piece might cover the gate.
Good question Martin! But yes I think all four positions would be available.

The fence on these Sentry 1250s is actually no wider than the width of the three wheels and with the slotted arm on my 1250 and Oldfast's 1250 being "stood off" somewhat from near surface of wheel three, (IMHO), I don't think the slotted arm would interfere with the fence.

EDIT: Thanks again Martin, with a little more thought and a closer look at the three different photos, I think you're probably right! At first I thought the slot might "fit the fence" when flipped around but with the position of the holes, it doesn't look like either of the positions with the arm flipped around, would provide the correct alignment to allow any engagement with the fence. So perhaps only two possible combos with the slotted arm style but likely four combos with the simple "drive connector" with no slotted arm.

Thanks for making me think this one through a little farther!

ZT
Last edited by ZTatZAU on Thu Jun 13, 2019 9:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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ZTatZAU

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Post Thu Jun 13, 2019 8:59 pm

Re: My First Post - My First Manipulation - My Thanks!

MartinHewitt wrote:Plug: For left-handed doors?
We seem to be composing and posting at the same time here Martin!

A right hand drive was my first thought too! But there is no such optional "large opening" where the dial is currently installed where there is (presumably) just a small hole for the dial shaft and three mounting screw holes to mount the wheel fixture. Would you agree?

ZT
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MartinHewitt

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Post Thu Jun 13, 2019 9:58 pm

Re: My First Post - My First Manipulation - My Thanks!

If you turn around the inside of the door for a left-handed soor, but keep the orientation of the outside cover ... Would that fit?
In case you wonder ... Martin Hewitt is a fictional detective in stories by Arthur Morrison:
Martin Hewitt, Investigator Chronicles of Martin Hewitt
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ZTatZAU

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Post Fri Jun 14, 2019 12:49 am

Re: My First Post - My First Manipulation - My Thanks!

MartinHewitt wrote:If you turn around the inside of the door for a left-handed soor, but keep the orientation of the outside cover ... Would that fit?
I'm not sure I know what you mean Martin. At first I thought we were both considering the possibility of swapping the dial and handle sides of the door. But now I'm wondering if you were speaking of changing which way the door swings when opened.

It's no matter though, because I think I've solved this mystery. I now see that there is another similar "plugged opening" on the bottom of the safe and I believe it is through these two openings that Sentry's proprietary "top secret" insulation is injected or poured.

ZT
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MartinHewitt

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Post Fri Jun 14, 2019 7:50 am

Re: My First Post - My First Manipulation - My Thanks!

Yes, I meant with left-handed the way the door swings.
In case you wonder ... Martin Hewitt is a fictional detective in stories by Arthur Morrison:
Martin Hewitt, Investigator Chronicles of Martin Hewitt
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