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Re: What am I getting myself into? Lock ID help, please

PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2018 4:38 pm
by L4R3L2
MartinHewitt wrote:I don*t know how S&G makes the locks for supporting a number change on the opening index, but the change on the Kromer lock is (besides a moved change key hole) only a more complex back wheel (W1) which has a lever that pushes the fence out of the gate (and thereby the cam gate) when you turn the change key. I assume it is similar in S&G locks.


If I'm understanding you correctly, I haven't seen any S&G that key change on the opening index. There always seems to be a changing index on the S&G key change locks. Interesting about the Kromer, though. Any chance to see photos of that feature?

Re: What am I getting myself into? Lock ID help, please

PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2018 5:06 pm
by MartinHewitt
There is somewhere a photo on koksa.org, but I can't find it.

The next best I can offer is: https://youtu.be/8gVVRCUaI-g?t=581
Sadly that guy doesn't show it, so there are just two seconds of him holding the wheel in his hand before inserting it again in the lock. This crescent shaped thing is it.

Re: What am I getting myself into? Lock ID help, please

PostPosted: Thu Nov 01, 2018 4:25 am
by L4R3L2
O.K. Another question.

The seller said, "Seated the lid and spun it, the pin released AND IT LOCKED!!!!"

Now, I don't know if he meant he spun the lid, or the dial. I know you have to turn the lid to secure it, and I don't think he would have spun the dial for no good reason, especially since most people wouldn't touch the dial if they were concerned about unintentionally locking a safe.

Please, study these photos. I see the way for the locking bolt on the underside of the seating lip in the one photo. I also see where the locking bolt goes in relation to the opening, at the ramped lug.

My question is, has anyone encountered a round door safe, whether a floor design or not, where the locking bolt is spring loaded? Where it could ride up the ramp of a lug as shown under spring tension and snap in place behind the lug to secure the door? Maybe that's a common design on these? I don't see any provision for a relocker, but that's my biggest fear at this point.

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Re: What am I getting myself into? Lock ID help, please

PostPosted: Thu Nov 01, 2018 8:46 am
by MartinHewitt
Dials are sooooo inviting! There are many many cases where a safe is not used at all or locked just with the key, the combination is forgotten and then somebody turns the dial. It doesn't need a reason to do this. I believe you could put a homo neanderthalensis in front of a safe and he will spin the dial.

Re: What am I getting myself into? Lock ID help, please

PostPosted: Thu Nov 01, 2018 10:57 am
by tarboxb
So I don't want to sound like a smart@$$ but unless I am hallucinating I see "M6730" printed on the back cover of the lock on the safe door...

Re: What am I getting myself into? Lock ID help, please

PostPosted: Thu Nov 01, 2018 11:26 am
by MartinHewitt
Smart@ss, you are probably right! What could the M mean? From books I believe the M has to do with Manipulation Proof, but these do have the butterfly dial, which this doesn't have. So probably in this lock it doesn't have to do with proofness.

Re: What am I getting myself into? Lock ID help, please

PostPosted: Thu Nov 01, 2018 11:42 am
by tarboxb
The M6730 is a later version of the "original 6730." It isn't manipulation proof.

Re: What am I getting myself into? Lock ID help, please

PostPosted: Thu Nov 01, 2018 11:47 am
by tarboxb

Re: What am I getting myself into? Lock ID help, please

PostPosted: Thu Nov 01, 2018 12:15 pm
by MartinHewitt
The original 6730 is the R6730?

Re: What am I getting myself into? Lock ID help, please

PostPosted: Thu Nov 01, 2018 12:21 pm
by tarboxb
No, the original 6730 was very different compared to the new ones. It also had a brass case and a flipper fence. It was the predecessor to this M6730. It also has the change index 11 numbers to the right on the dial.

Re: What am I getting myself into? Lock ID help, please

PostPosted: Thu Nov 01, 2018 12:25 pm
by tarboxb
OriginalXSXGX6730.jpg

Re: What am I getting myself into? Lock ID help, please

PostPosted: Thu Nov 01, 2018 1:16 pm
by MartinHewitt
Thanks!

Re: What am I getting myself into? Lock ID help, please

PostPosted: Thu Nov 01, 2018 1:29 pm
by tarboxb
You're welcome! You can also see in the pictures in that link I sent on the M6730 that the back cover also has "M6730" stamped on it. I am virtually 100% positive that is the lock he will be dealing with.

Re: What am I getting myself into? Lock ID help, please

PostPosted: Thu Nov 01, 2018 3:17 pm
by L4R3L2
tarboxb wrote:So I don't want to sound like a smart@$$ but unless I am hallucinating I see "M6730" printed on the back cover of the lock on the safe door...


No fair! Your screen resolution is better than mine...and...and....you knew they were stamped there with the model number!

I think you are right. No, it looks like there is no question you are right! In my own defense, though, I couldn't make out the numbers, and didn't know S&G stamped model numbers like that, so I assumed it was just a serial number of some sort applied by the safe manufacturer. All the others I've seen with model numbers have them molded into the case back. So, now we know!!! Thank you!

Martin, the progression seems to have been plain numbers, to "M", to "R" prefixes. The manipulation proof models I've seen are suffixed with "MP".

Re: What am I getting myself into? Lock ID help, please

PostPosted: Thu Nov 01, 2018 4:24 pm
by tarboxb
No worries L4R3L2. Everyone misses things sometimes. I may be wrong but I don't think it is common to see the model number like that. It seems that the M6730 has it but I can't say about any others. Your C87 doesn't have it.