another safe cracked & information about manipulation

[webpirate]

So this is kind of a 1/2 brag and 1/2 informative post...

I cracked another safe today but the results were very unusual in the sense that it took me almost 2 hours.. Which is unusual as I have been spoiled with 15-45 minute averages..

Here is the safe https://www.flickr.com/photos/webpirate/shares/07pj1c

So here is what happened. My tried and true method left me with no low points and exact same reading over the whole lock. I pulled every trick I could think of. Out of desperation I did an AWR reading and finally got a number. After getting the nunber it was about 15 minutes to crack it open.. Just seems strange that an AWR would be different than an AWL. Even after getting the number I double and triple checked the number with AWL and there was no indication..
So nowbI have and extra trick that I will use more readily instead of just out of desperation...

[Fabricator-X]

When you finally found a number by stacking AWR, which wheel was it on?

[Jaakko Fagerlund]

AWL is different than AWR and vice versa as per indications go, as the wheels are just ever so slightly aligned differently. The fly mechanisms can give 1.5 number differences when switching directions.

Other trick is what I've learned: Anything you can dial you can try. So, if AWL or AWR doesn't give anything, then just pick some number to park wheels to and start by going only one wheel at a time only to find indications. It is not forbidden, as there is no rules

[webpirate]

The number was 93 on wheel 2. I have never had to do AWR before.. But just out of desperation I tried it and it was successful. Then 15 minutes later it was open. The good thing is that a 1:45 lesson will never be forgotten...

[Oldfast]

Webpirtate!!! Very nice! Always love seeing your latest openings
In fact I still visit your flickr page once in a while just to look through
the variety of safes you've opened... and to see if anything new is up.

So you've brought up a great point. Direction should never be dismissed from your tool bag.
I've had many occasions, both with graphing & testing, where direction played a crucial role.

Here's one example taken from an Ilco Unican P67. Two very different graphs due to direction.
Where there was only 1/10 of a drop with an AWR.... a clearly defined gate appears with AWL.
Additionally, aside from just the gate itself, the two graphs vary considerably throughout.

As already mentioned (and you already know): A change in rotational direction involves the flys.
The width of them, as they stack upon each other, creates a slight change in the wheels' positions
in relation to each other. I agree with you - it's rather surprising that such a small change could have
such a pronounced effect. But it absolutely does! And sometimes the differences are like night & day.

Also, I tend to think there's something else too that factors into rotational differences. Admittedly, this is
more speculation on my part than fact, but... there's a small amount of play that exists between the wheels
and the wheel post (some locks more than others). Different rotational forces may lift the wheels up or press
them down onto the wheel post. Again, creating more inconsistency.

p.s. Funny, our preference to rotation are just the opposite. I usually start with and all wheels right and
would prefer to spin right if possible. Of course, ultimately I go the direction the lock tells me to go. lol
But hey, there's really no right or wrong.... just right or left

[webpirate]

Thanks for the replies...

The most important thing that I forgot to mention is the embarrassing bolt work on this safe...